FIA/ACO to create universal GT class

[TF110]

I liked the GT1 type cars with 550-600hp weights around 1100-1200kg. Theyd be a little fast and probably mess with lmp2 but I miss those 200mph monsters!

[arakis]

My point of view is probably well known to most of you.. But I'll put in my 2C as well...

I would be most happy with a completely rule based racing series, 0 Bop 0 waivers..

Your car is not up to scratch, you lose. your car is outside of the regs, you don't race... But I see how this would not be too popular with most of the fans... So I have a little add on...

0 waiwers stays... but put together a roling BoP system.. like it was in the old FIA GT days.. add weight to the winning car, keep adding it. add some if a car wins, remove some if they lose. Next season is started with the same base weights the last one ended.. etc...(perhaps add some weight to the championship winning car just couse )

This would still give manufacturers some bragging rights for building a better car. and would keep the BoP fair... (=

[Maelochs]

I'd say the best way would be something like the way FIA GT1-3---have a driver---except I'd want a few drivers---lap a couple different courses early in the year and again at mid-season, to see what the cars could do when the team wasn't sandbagging, and base the BoP on that.

Once BoP was set, GT+ could modify certain areas, GT-Am could just race. Halfway through the year, cars that were less modified could get a little break, so factories wouldn't go nuts on mods-lots of development, but no spending wars, because some cars which did very little might get balanced out to be even with the cars from factories that spent wildly.

Otherwise, Audi R8s and Ferrari 458s would win every race because they are naturally the more racy chassis.

[Pandamasque]

Originally Posted by urdragon

Even discarding homologation expired cars, too much work for the fans to understand (allthough some of us even do not understand current BoP anyway).

There's nothing to understand there as it's regulated by politicking, moaning etc. and cars are far from their road-going origins. The current BoP system is BY FAR less fan-friendly.

Originally Posted by urdragon

The problem to that is how to let some technical competition without changing the base car $$$$ that shouldn't let it's cost increase, for a car designed to be raced by privateers , if everything is messed up in 2016, is to achieve a comoon base car, and for this reason, base cost shouldn't increase for privateers, if a formula is found not affecting privateers for this, all will be perfect.

Otherwise (If keeping cost low for privateers is not posible) discard a comoon base model for GT and GT+ (Like nowadays) or discard technical competition.

I don't see the problem. The base car is the same for GT+ and GT and is not going to evolve. It's not a prototype. The classes will differ in terms of additional modifications that can be made. A private team would be able to buy a second-hand GT+ car and bring it to base GT spec by replacing some of the parts.

[urdragon]

Originally Posted by Pandamasque

A private team would be able to buy a second-hand GT+ car and bring it to base GT spec by replacing some of the parts.

Then this, limits evolving parts, which will not be of the like of everybody, what parts can be evolved and what not? (I suppose those expensiver shouldn't be evolved), i'm not sure most of this will not increase costs too much, a list of banned evolves should be prepared by the FIA/ACO.

Moreover, somehow, a way should be found of making MFGs not charge their developements over the weaker (politically talking) privaters, otherways on long term the class is doomed with the demise of privaters first and then weaker MFGs and with them, the diversity for me this is the real hazard. BoP with freezing specs is now is restraining the costs, despite of the political tricks that the BoP sadly brings.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by urdragon

Then this, limits evolving parts, which will not be of the like of everybody, what parts can be evolved and what not? (I suppose those expensiver shouldn't be evolved), i'm not sure most of this will not increase costs too much, a list of banned evolves should be prepared by the FIA/ACO.

Moreover, somehow, a way should be found of making MFGs not charge their developements over the weaker (politically talking) privaters, otherways on long term the class is doomed with the demise of privaters first and then weaker MFGs and with them, the diversity for me this is the real hazard. BoP with freezing specs is now is restraining the costs, despite of the political tricks that the BoP sadly brings.

IMO it should follow more of the ACO model. Where what is allowed to be developed on the GT+ is listed. Very, very, few things should be on that list and everything else is not allowed at all to vary from the homologation, outside of BoP issues.








L.P.

[ger80]

I think they should use the same regs for GT and GT+
GT+ cars for the works teams and top teams.
The Am teams run in GT and use the same regulations with a BOP that makes them ~5 sec per lap slower in Le Mans. That way you can use year old GT+ cars, run the engine less aggressive and take the most expensive mods from road to GT+ car out.

[Pandamasque]

Originally Posted by urdragon

Moreover, somehow, a way should be found of making MFGs not charge their developements over the weaker (politically talking) privaters, otherways on long term the class is doomed with the demise of privaters first and then weaker MFGs and with them, the diversity for me this is the real hazard. BoP with freezing specs is now is restraining the costs, despite of the political tricks that the BoP sadly brings.

I agree. In privateer class development should be limited to reliability-enhancing upgrades. There's no point in developing performance updates in a BoP regulated class.

[Mt. Lynx]

In GT+ the AM has to use one year old equipment, as is custom in the current GTE imo. GT should just adapt to the GT3 rules.

GT+ in that case should be GT3 with better aero, carbon brakes and a better power-to- weight ratio.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Mt. Lynx

In GT+ the AM has to use one year old equipment, as is custom in the current GTE imo. GT should just adapt to the GT3 rules.

GT+ in that case should be GT3 with better aero, carbon brakes and a better power-to- weight ratio.

Gt3 rules? I am unfamiliar with those.

[broadrun96]

Wait, GT3 has rules? Thought it was build what ya want and we will add cinder blocks if needed.

[TF110]

I would like to see cars with a set height of the car, maximum width of 2100mm, full width rear wing at the height of the maximum height of the car (roof level), max width diffuser with a set of rules for fins etc., front splitter depth, two separate diveplanes with set dimensions, underbody aero somewhat free, 1200kg minimum weight, engine and chassis based off production car's unit, 14" tires 19" wheels, open to hybrids. Im sure theres stuff left out, like chassis construction and engine upgrades etc. But that would be my basis for GT + cars. Bigger and wider wheels would be great since the road cars come with 20" wheels nowadays, and Vipers have 13.5" wide tires stock.

[joeb]

In coordination with the new GT regs, it looks like GTE is still a viable class until 2018

https://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=21071

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by joeb

In coordination with the new GT regs, it looks like GTE is still a viable class until 2018

https://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=21071

That's too far away IMO.

Those teams sitting on the fence waiting will just jump off and walk away.

[Koenigsegg]

Originally Posted by Simmi

That's too far away IMO.

Those teams sitting on the fence waiting will just jump off and walk away.

GTE cars are being grandfathered until at least 2018. Meaning that the new regs will come before 2018, but teams can still use the old machinery.

[urdragon]

Not really news, except for investors, that article means that on 2018 will no longer acepted GTE, so to resume says they will coexist (GT+ and GTE) 2015/2016 to 2018 in WEC/ELMS/ASLMS/NorthAmerica.

[carbon_titanium]

With the same performance level, if GT or GT+ will be cheaper to buy and mantain than GTE cars, my bet is that we will see GTE cars only in official teams hands.

[Koenigsegg]

Originally Posted by carbon_titanium

With the same performance level, if GT or GT+ will be cheaper to buy and mantain than GTE cars, my bet is that we will see GTE cars only in official teams hands.

What do you mean with official teams? As in manufacturers? Every team that races is an official team.

Manufacturers will be the first to change to GT+ machinery, since they are the ones that will develop and produce the GT+ machinery.

[NaBUru38]

"Official team" = Works team in Spanish, French and other languages

[Ephaeton]

Some efforts never die... (MST, ger) The FIA plans for GT reform - a new GT world championship?

tl;dr: Schurig revisits the scene. It's all 2014 again, but now with fresh quotes / names / models. So if you missed the (failed) effort last time, you can witness it failing now for 2019 and begin your trip with a yay long article from Schurig.

[deggis]

Ratel sounds disinterested unless it is with manufacturer teams.

Basis again GT3 or "GT3+"... but Ratel himself said there is already "GT3+", GTE.

[Coach Ep]

More megalomania by the FIA, they must be in need for more world championship fees...

[deggis]

Some tl;dr:

- FIA GT Commission President Christian Schacht is trying to open discussions again, after the GT3-GTE convergence talks failed in 2014 and manufacturers are open to this
- Stephane Ratel sounds disinterested in the new championship idea unless this would be with manufacturer teams, he knows why the GT1 World Championship (2010-2012) failed and on the other hand he knows why Blancpain currently is successful
- for the championship basis would be again GT3, or something like "GT3+", jokingly Ratel says there is already "GT3+": GTE
- year 2019 is thrown around for the next posible convergence
- somewhat same problems remain: others want strict rules (Porsche quote), others want to no rules because BoP takes care of everything anyway (unnamed quote)
- in 2014 the major sticking point was air restrictors vs. torque sensors, now there may be more common ground because turbo cars in GTE already run without air restrictors

[MagVanisher]

Wow, another GT convergence... Good luck with that though, but it's not gonna happen!

[TF110]

I hope it does happen. Wouldn't it be great to see Mercedes, McLaren, BMW, Honda, Lexus, Lamborghini etc. GT's at LM? A rule convergence would make that possible.