MST Results - Caterham Racing

[Dan Friel]

I've just watched (on World Motorsport) the end of a caterham race from Brands where it's obvious that the wrong driver was awarded the win. How can this be possible and can it be a typical MST problem?

[roys1]

Originally Posted by Dan Friel

I've just watched (on World Motorsport) the end of a caterham race from Brands where it's obvious that the wrong driver was awarded the win. How can this be possible and can it be a typical MST problem?

I don't know which race you are talking about but there was a caterham race there with a winning margin of 0.001 of a second.. someone once worked it out to about 10cm .. but i also believe that it depends on where the transponder is on the car... A visual check should be done but who could argue against a computer!!!!! I agree it is wrong......

[gachjoel]

So its not a case of who`s car crosses the line 1st.
but who`s transponer crosses 1st.

out of curiousity,is it up to the team where the transponder is placed or is it same place for everyone ?

[chezza]

Also there was a race at brands towards the end of the season where the winner wasn't the winner due to a time penalty...it could be that?

Yes it can be down to transponder position, and no you can put it where the hell you like.

[Chris Y]

I was told though that a 'light beam' on the start/finish line always determines the places, not the transponder, so there could have been a mix-up there.

[Asp]

AFAIK, the light beam determines when the line was crossed - hence you can put the transponder anywhere and it won't change your laptime.
The transponder then confirms the order - so if two cars are very close it's possible for the transponder on the second placed car to be registered before that on the first place.
So, like Chris says, that's where things get muddled up.

I seem to recall at some point in the dim and distant that the timing results produced a result; but after either discussion with the time keepers (they were watching the line and saw the other car passed first); or possible even on appeal (with video evidence) the timing results were reversed.

[Dan Friel]

It was the race with the winning margin of 0.001 (which was the wrong result). Never really thought about the postioning of the transponder being so critical.

[scrutineer]

Does this mean everyone will move them to the front bumper and have them knocked off on the first corner

[graeme]

I believed that transponders were just to record the positions of the cars, and that timekeepers/lightbeam recorded the times (including the finish time).

Caterham transponders are usually on the steering rack mount, under the nose cone - it's a recommendation rather than reg.

I saw the footage and agree it seemed the other way around - but perhaps it was just a bad camera angle. Or maybe the timekeepers did mistakenly classified them the wrong way around - and no-one protested it as it was the last race of the season, didn't affect the championship and was politically a good result...? (Though the second placed guy didn't seem very happy in the interview).

[Tick Tock Man]

As Asp said, the light beam is what is used to record the time and the transponder to identify who it belongs to.

When 2 cars cross the line together it is possible that the tranbsponder of the second one will be detected before the transponder of the first one. Where live timing feeds are being used this can cause what appears to be an incorrect result to be displayed. A manual reversal of the order would then be done.

[jonbryant]

I was there for this and initially the win was awarded to the bloke who's name I can't remember. But it was then reversed whilst they were on the slowing down lap.

Thats my recollection of it anyway. It was a SUPERB race anyway

[Asp]

Originally Posted by Tick Tock Man

A manual reversal of the order would then be done.

How is agreement on who was first reached if the cars are so close it's impossible to tell who crossed the line first by naked eye?

Does the technology allow working out the positions of the cars; or does it even require looking at the cars and the position of the transponders?

[chezza]

Also said actions require people to be actually watching now whilst all time keepers should be doing this, I bet there are some finishes that have been missed.

[graeme]

Originally Posted by chezza

Also said actions require people to be actually watching now whilst all time keepers should be doing this, I bet there are some finishes that have been missed.

Too right - I went missing from the MST results last season as I past the finish line one lap on the grass and no-one in the timekeepers box directly opposite saw it.

[sfaulds]

The result was not awarded from a transponder position - the timekeepers and CoC made the call based on photo, video and visual evidence.

[Dan Friel]

Presumbly this other footage showed something different from the Sky coverage then - which did look rather conclusive...