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Old 2 Mar 2010, 20:44 (Ref:2643574)   #51
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Originally Posted by cthib10 View Post
How do you figure?
If Indycar didn't have such terrible ratings on a major network it would still be there (instead of VS channel) not to mention sponsors would be jumping at the chance to bring their money to the sport. The lack of viewers is causing the problem in every possible way financially.
More viewers=more sponsors and money

The switch to VS channel really hurt Indycar but it only got to that point after the dive in ratings year after year which in turn caused most sponsors and potential sponsors to look elsewhere. There isn't a major network now that will throw out big bucks to show a series people aren't watching which is why VS ended up with Indycar because the investment would be terrible due to LACK OF VIEWERSHIP. You get people to watch the races and things will start to work themselves out.
A symptom is a marker indicating the presence of disease. In the case of Indy Car racing, it is boring, there is no real competition. Spec car after spec car. There's nothing interesting about it except the variety of tracks. As a result fewer and fewer people will watch. Simple.
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Old 2 Mar 2010, 23:08 (Ref:2643677)   #52
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Yep

Exciting competition = interested viewers = repeat customers = development of fan favorites = increased value and effect of promotions = increased sponsorship investment = better competition
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 12:46 (Ref:2644001)   #53
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They could also throw in a better looking car I mean the ones they run now are so cheap looking and a couple of the proposed cars for 2012 are pretty dull too. The thing they could do is go with the Delta Wing then I think that would finally be it for me Indycar would just be too terrible for me to watch.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 12:53 (Ref:2644011)   #54
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climb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridclimb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
climb thinks the Delta wing cars would have too many (under)steering problems; doesn't like them
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 14:30 (Ref:2644077)   #55
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Originally Posted by cthib10 View Post
The series can be terrible (ie..Nascar) and can still be a very stable series if people watch it. As long as people watch sponsors and money will be there .

That being said I think the reason people aren't watching is because Indycar is basically turning into Nascar as a spec series just with different looking cars that run faster. We don't need two of the same types of series in this country as you can see not enough fans to go around. If the series stays as in eventually it will be unsustainable financially.
The big difference with Indy and Nascar is you have more than one manufacturer and this offers variety. In the case of Nascar these manufacturers produce every day road cars, so there will be Nascar fans who drive Ford and Nascar fans who drive Dodge so you have built in brand and fan loyalty, which makes for good healthy rivalry. If they all drove the same car Nascar would have been finished years ago.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 16:02 (Ref:2644129)   #56
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They DO all drive the same car in NASCAR; there is no practical difference with the CoT, but just different brand decals, or whatever they use, slapped/wrapped around the common-template bodies. NASCAR hasn't actually been "stock" car racing in 30 years.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 16:26 (Ref:2644143)   #57
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They DO all drive the same car in NASCAR; there is no practical difference with the CoT, but just different brand decals, or whatever they use, slapped/wrapped around the common-template bodies. NASCAR hasn't actually been "stock" car racing in 30 years.
This is true the cars are all exactly the same on the outside now except for decals. The COT finished off what was left of different auto makers distinct features in the series.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 17:14 (Ref:2644168)   #58
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They DO all drive the same car in NASCAR; there is no practical difference with the CoT, but just different brand decals, or whatever they use, slapped/wrapped around the common-template bodies. NASCAR hasn't actually been "stock" car racing in 30 years.
I should have said if they all drove the same "manufacturer's" car, e.g. if they were all Ford.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 19:37 (Ref:2644271)   #59
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Brand rivalries are great: Ford vs Chevrolet / Holden / Vauxhall (every corner of this planet), Mercedes vs Audi (current DTM), Mitsubishi vs Subaru (WRC some years ago)... But they work better in tin-topped cars, that means production cars or road car lookalikes.

F1 doesn't actually need brands, but teams: Ferrari, McLaren, Williams, Lotus. Two of them didn't build road cars in decades, yet they still gathered fandom. So I believe that IndyCar would welcome engine brand rivalries, but even more team rivalries. Penske and Ganassi are there and should allow fiercer rivalry without losing chivalry, for example.
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Old 3 Mar 2010, 19:55 (Ref:2644291)   #60
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F1 teams are "brands" to a certain extent; just look at how they market themselves. Could you envisage a green Ferrari? What also makes F1 so interesting is there are different Constructors involved. There are the Grandees like Ferrari, the Privateers such as Tyrrell or Williams and then you have your hybrids, like Lotus who made a range of high perfomance road cars and McLaren who have gone down a similar route with their McLaren F1.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 08:20 (Ref:2644640)   #61
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Originally Posted by mountainstar View Post
Actually there is no tobacco ban!

The reason they don't sponsor racing cars or anything else is due to a self imposed ban as part of an agreement with the US government. And part of it is political correctness and PR.

Who knows all that could come back someday.

I'd say if your revenue model was dependent on tobacco revenue you have a crap business model.

Yes you would have a poor business model....
CART/Indycar had more revenue than Nascar before the 'agreement'....and when Players, Kool, etc went those teams struggled for replacements, and overall revenue dropped.
Nascar lost Winston but had a strategy-they went for mainstream consumer companies. They won huge support from promotions by those companies.
The IRL tried the upcoming .com companies but many of those companies crashed and burned, they didb't put moey into promotion and the IRL didn't really nurtue or assist them. CART didn't have a strategy and gradually lost more and more revenue and subsequent support as there were few really good quality replacements and few that actually invested in the sport.

There were otehr factor invoved but teh truth is that the other factors coupled with the loss of revenue hit Open wheel at an critical time.
If the tobacco 'ban' hadn't happened could they have weathered the storm and handled the other factors.....And the probable answer is yes.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 16:27 (Ref:2644920)   #62
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Could you envisage a green Ferrari?
Ugly, but I do: 599 HY-KERS.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 17:52 (Ref:2644975)   #63
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Yes you would have a poor business model....
CART/Indycar had more revenue than Nascar before the 'agreement'....and when Players, Kool, etc went those teams struggled for replacements, and overall revenue dropped.
Nascar lost Winston but had a strategy-they went for mainstream consumer companies. They won huge support from promotions by those companies.
The IRL tried the upcoming .com companies but many of those companies crashed and burned, they didb't put moey into promotion and the IRL didn't really nurtue or assist them. CART didn't have a strategy and gradually lost more and more revenue and subsequent support as there were few really good quality replacements and few that actually invested in the sport.

There were otehr factor invoved but teh truth is that the other factors coupled with the loss of revenue hit Open wheel at an critical time.
If the tobacco 'ban' hadn't happened could they have weathered the storm and handled the other factors.....And the probable answer is yes.
Sounds like the problem was bad management, not loss of tobacco. Transitioning from being the Winston Cup to the Nextel Cup was a much bigger hurdle than what open wheel had to deal with on the tobacco front. The Split was what screwed up American open wheel while F1 continued to grow.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 19:44 (Ref:2645053)   #64
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Yes, guys, I can envisage a green Ferrari. And actually, I thought the Olive Garden 550 that ran GTS in the ALMS looked pretty good.
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Old 5 Mar 2010, 02:06 (Ref:2645243)   #65
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Yes, guys, I can envisage a green Ferrari. And actually, I thought the Olive Garden 550 that ran GTS in the ALMS looked pretty good.
It wouldn't be a works car, which is my point.
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