Problems in the ALMS

[billnchristy]

Since we have pretty much completely hijacked the Porsche thread...why not start a new one? I am not intending this to be a GA vs. ALMS thread. GA will only be mentioned when relative...hopefully.

IN MY EYES this is what is wrong with ALMS:

1) Management never stands up for its mistakes and creates accomplishments to cover, or avert you from them.

2) Theyre coming , theyre coming! The only things that ARE coming for sure will not help the sport. A new Audi...gee thanks, a different car to dominate. A new Porsche...Ditto. WHO WILL STEP UP TO THESE??

3) ALMS race management is horrible. There is no tradition save for Sebring and Petit. (GA reference) every year I know GA will race at Daytona for 24hrs, Miami, WGI (multiple times now, but at least for 6hrs), Mt. Tremblant for 6, California speedway, Mid-O,Barber, VIR and Daytona again. And they are ADDING every year, not taking away. The "Cheaper" structure will allow privateers to run more races in front of more people...this works in America because you need to be seen or you are forgotten!

4) The rules. They change so often, obsolete machinery that could probably just evolved. You rule out your chances for constructors and privateers caring. Do you know what tooling costs are?? (GA ref) If it cost over 100k just to tool up some DP die casts, imagine what it costs making molds for all the expensive carbon tubs and panels let alone custom suspension components. I dont understand how anyone would think constant changes are good. Put a minimum on the changes, 3 years or something that lets me know if I buy a car I will still be able to race it.

That will do for now, hopefully we can have a spirited and mature discussion.

[JAG]

The current LMP900 regs have been in place, pretty much unchanged, since 97 and the days of the Joest WSC.

How longs the Viper been around for?

[billnchristy]

But what good is it? What has ALMS done to make it competitive?

For god's sake man, the Panoz last year which wasnt setting the world on fire for lap times was lapping the Viper like it was a safety truck at LRP!! Every lap the Panoz would gain like 5-10 seconds on it.

That is not healthy for a series to have sick cars limping around.

For instance, the Van De Steur B2k/40. that car is from 2000!!

Thats why I said evolutions, something to keep them on top or near the pile...or competitive prices on upgrades...something.

That is what ALMS privateer racing looks like, and it is sad!

[billnchristy]

Oh and I dont think making the manufactureres sell cars will help, I think that will just make the factories go away once and for all.

A perfect world would see 15 Audis, 10 Porsches, 6 C6r vs 8 Astons and 4 Ferraris but the EGOS of the factories wont allow it.

In fact EGO seems to be the main problem with the system on a whole

BTW Thanks for coming to the party!

[JAG]

Who said the Viper was competitive?

Its just an example of rules stability.

If you want to be competitive buy a 550 or better still an Aston.

The Van De Steur B2k/40 is not an ACO car. It was designed to the old FIA SR2 regs.

The 'MG' Lola that dyson runs was designed at the same time as the Lola B2K/40 and is still bang on the pace.

For your information Aston have confirmed 14 Astons have now been sold.

If you wanted to be competitive with the R8, ALMS teams could have bought a Zytek, but they chose not to. Thats their loss.

I've said it before, the ALMS privateers suffered at the hands of the works BMW LMRs and Audi R8s. The privateer chassis of the time were not upto the job.

LMES teams were able to asses what was required to be competitve and plan appropriatly. The new reg chassis and engine manufactuers have upped their game, they had too.

This year was totally predictable, we all knew it was going to be like this, why the shock.

Forgive me if I'm not worrying too much with the a new Audi, Lola and Riley on the way in P1, who knows maybe a Zytek, Porsche and Radical in P2 and Aston in GT1!

BTW, I would like to see GA succeed also, but not at the expense of the ALMS.

Its all well and good having 30, 40 DPs, but any more than 20 will be difficult to sustain. Its impossible to contain costs if competition increases, manufactuers will spend in the areas were they can make a difference.

[TheNewBob]

"What has the ALMS done to make it competitive?"

Like Jag said, those LMP900 regs have been in place since 1997, and the Audi R8 conforms to those regs. To make competition better they keep trying to peg back it's performance. But let's face it, Audi simply made an incredible sportscar.

Plus you complain about the "Van De Steur B2k/40" being from 2000 - I thought you wanted rules stability? If you ask for that, then you get old cars like that running around.

Let's not forget the Viper has been around since... 1992? 1993? The 'vette's pretty much since '99, the Audi's since 2000, low class GT Porsches have been around seemingly forever, all with updates to keep them running. The Porsches dominate their class, as do the 'Vettes (with an ever-closing Saleen), LMP2 has been a bit of a random class for a while, and LMP1 in ALMS consist of updated cars which have been around for a while.

I think your worries about rules stability are seen to. Class rules have been in place for ages, they're changing now because it's time to update everything, ask the ACO that. The ALMS started in '99 running to the same classes it does today - I wudn't complain about that, personally.

[billnchristy]

I do want stability, I also want competitive stability.

You know as well as I that I cannot go out and buy a B2k/40 and be competitive in ALMS. If I went out and bought a Fabcar, arguably one of the WORSE DPs out there. I can shoot for a top 10. Sure you can get a top ten in ALMS because there arent 10 in your class, but you get the picture.

Yeah Autocon can run their Riley MkIII, but can they RACE it? No.

If ALMS cared about the privateer something, weight breaks, restrictor breaks...anything could be done to help these guys out...you know why it doesnt happen? If all the moons aligned and somehow the CA Viper had a PERFECT race, maybe it was strategy and actually got out and beat the C6Rs GM would have a tizzy!!

But what can CA do? They obviously dont have the money for an Aston because they probably would have bought one?

What can they do? Hmmm...

BTW Pardon my scrambled thoughts...I dont feel well today and I have many ideas on why the ALMS isnt succeeding, its just not coming out very clear. So I will probably contridict myself constantly and I apoligize...I swear there is logic in there somewhere!!

[Joe Taylor]

Why do I get the feeling of ?

[JAG]

A similar vintage Dallara is currently leading the drivers P1 Championship in the LMES, against hybrids, Zyteks and an Audi.

All on a tight budget.

Maybe if AutoCon had competed in full ALMS seasons, the R&S would be much closer to the ultimate pace.

And much as I admiore tha CA Viper, you can't possibly give the car enough performance breaks to make it competitive with the C6R's.

Buy an Aston or hire a Care 550.

[SALEEN S7R]

Originally Posted by JAG

Maybe if AutoCon had competed in full ALMS seasons, the R&S would be much closer to the ultimate pace.

Yeah thats true, but what also doesent help the Autocon R&S IMO is the driving line up, dont get me wrong Michael Lewis is a decent driver but he certainly isnt top draw, as for Bryan Willman, well lets just say hes not the quickest guy out there in a race car and leave it at that. Im not saying that with a good driving line up that the R&S will be competitve for overall race wins again but IMO it could be faster than the lead LMP 2 cars still and somewhere near the pace of the Dyson and Champion cars. The closest I beleive the R&S has come this season to being on the pace this year was at Portland in qualifying where the car was only 4 seconds off the pole time.

[jhansen]

I'm not sure, Tim probably knows, but I don't see Autocon spending that much. There are definitely some older platforms out there that can still be competitive.

[jhansen]

Billnchristy, is the ALMS perfect? No I don’t think so. But I think that they have a good vision for the sport and are making a concerted effort to grow the series. Not to mention they are filling an important niche in the North American market. They don’t have an easy task though. Especially considering how NASCAR has affected the positioning and marketing of racing in the United States.

I would like to see the series become more stable in terms of schedule. I’d like to see markets dumped that are not benefiting the series. New venues in markets that could serve the series well should be added. And the staples of the series should be held on to tightly. I certainly think it is essential for IMSA and the ALMS to have some freedom to look out for its own best interests while maintaining a healthy working relationship with the ACO. While the Le Mans name is a definite marketing advantage, it does have its limitations. IMSA and the ALMS should have the ability to work around that. And I believe we have seen that in the recent past, which is a good thing.

We have definitely seen some circumstances work against the ALMS over the past three years in terms of the rules changes. Many people knew it was coming. Some people are now understanding it. And some just will not get it. I think Jag has made some good points about feeder series, which is a real dilemma.

I’m intelligent enough to know that the ALMS cannot continue on the “wait and see” strategy. It is put up or shut up time. I’m hoping that they’ll play their cards well, as I think the opportunities are there and the product is good.

As for GARRA, it is not for me. This isn't meant as a bash, but it just sucks. It offers me nothing as a race fan, as it has nothing I want. That's just my opinion of course. I've checked it out. I’ve tried watching it. But it's not my cup of tea. If it’s yours, then I hope you’ll continue to enjoy it. But do be careful, the NASCAR influence is there and it’s only going to grow.

[billnchristy]

We can all hope that the ALMS survives. But to do so with the market as it is, there needs to be major changes. If you legitimately think that 3+ yo chassis can be competitive why isnt anyone running them?

Why is GA so much more alluring? Ive seen B2k/40s for 62k that is cheaper than a speed WC TC! There must be many reasons people avoid older LMPs like the plague...is the technology that is used to make them the ultimate evil? Being we all know a carbon tub is only good for so much abuse (ala intersport) are these cars being sold just heaps that could never be consistant?

If that is the case, which I imagine a heavily raced car would be pretty used after 3 years, maybe all this "technology" is not that important. You could make a strong aluminum tubbed car with steel frame for cheap. It will be heavier, if the rules accounted for that and let you run a bigger or less restricted engine, i bet there would be 6 or more of them in the field...if they worked and were at least mildly competitive.

[Fogelhund]

Bill, I'll give credit, where credit is due, but there is none due here.

Your point three is wrong and your point four is wrong.

As far as the B2K/40, I seem to recall one winning many races last year, and should have won the championship. Not bad for a car that was never designed for these rules, and is five years old.

3 yo + chassis list. Champion Audi, Dyson Lola's, Rollcentre Dallara, all the Zytek's, the Pescarolo, the Courage LMP1's, the Lister, the Domes..... They seem to all be running in one place or another.

You wax eloquently about Autocon, CA and van der Steur's lack of competitiveness.

Let's list the cars... Riley, Viper and Lola B2K.
Let's list the fastest cars in class. Audi/Corvette/Lola

I'd be willing to put a decent wager down that you could swop Autocon, CA and van der Steur's cars with Champion, P&M and Intersport.... let them all setup, work on, test their own cars (just for a week or so)... and Champion, P&M and Intersport would still cream Autocon, CA and van der Steur.

At the end of the day, there are teams that are not going to win. It's not that they shouldn't be there, or that they aren't valued, but they just won't win... and it wouldn't matter what series they went to for that matter.

While there may be some issues with the present ALMS setup, you've missed them.

[dj4monie]

This is beating a dead horse....

PCM annouced they wouldn't continue in the series and the boo birds came out.

Did they make any differece anyway? I would like thank PCM for trying, they ran pretty well considering they are totally NOVICES to endurance racing.

They could be back, I wouldn't want to run vs GM Racing in an "old" car anyway.

Then Porsche isn't coming. C'mon they would have dominated P2 anyway and then you really would be complaining next year when Penske wins the team and manufactures championship.

That class sorely needs a respectibly boost.

What you need to have is cars available.

Frankly the Prodrive built 550's wouldn't have faired much better this season, but the C5R was hardly the only option and Acemco was EXCITED because they got alot of what the ACO took away from them at the start of the season only to take it back. IMSA did the RIGHT thing and gave it back, plus some HP increases.

They are only .500 off the leading Corvette this week and only .200 off the second car.

So there's HOPE that Acemco can break through and maybe steel one before the end of the season. Considering the problems both Prodrive and Corvette had at Sebring I predicted they would win Sebring actually, it just didn't happen that way.

If they went to Le Mans, I'm postitive they would have been in the hunt at least until the car failed.

The quality is there, but I rather have a lower car count, than 10-15 more cars not in the hunt for victory either.

It takes alot of resources to beat any of the top team in ALMS and I don't think its IMSA job to LOWER THE BAR to allow small teams to be competitive. So basically what your saying is that Dyson, who would be kicking arse in Grand Am also if they choose to go that direction, is some how lesser of a private team???

Dyson is competitive WEEK IN and WEEK OUT with his cars despite the reilablity issues. Alot of people could have gone this direction, but they choose not too.

Is that IMSA's fault?

Panoz has been trying to get somebody to run his cars in GT for two years. He finally said "fug it" and ran the cars themsevles. Its on pace with the TOP Porsches because they know to beat the best you have to be at your best, so they got the best drivers they could find, they felt.

They fixed whatever held the car back. You know your on to something when the ACO strikes you down...

Please stop with the gloom and doom post...

On every sportscar board there some wanna-be ALMS fan that says the ski is falling, the ski is falling.

So what if the Grand Am series has a series sponsor. Who know's how long that will last. They may have gotten good TV numbers but nobody is going to the races and the racing honestly isn't that close.

If teams over there were serious people like Duno or any of the gentlemen driver's wouldn't be in the cars period.

That alone shows you the level of competition when you compare series.

Rob Dyson stepped out of the car and he's doing what he can to keep his son in the car and he's doing a good job.

That's how a small team like Dyson moves up to the big time.

More teams should follow his model and its been sucessful...

You don't need help from the series to be competitive.

[billnchristy]

Thank you for telling me that I am wrong in my own eyes.

That is brilliance.

If ALMS race management doesnt suck I dont know what does.

Teams that cannot win are abundant is motorsports. Not being a student of statistics I will take a wild stab that a team that cannot win in GA would win 1 race out of 50. A team that cannot win in ALMS would win 1 out of 250. SWC maybe 1 in 100.

But at least these teams that cannot win can lead, and occasionally show brillance...I have not seen that in ALMS because there is a car no one can beat on a race by race basis. How can you think that is healthy?

[dj4monie]

Originally Posted by billnchristy

Thank you for telling me that I am wrong in my own eyes.

That is brilliance.

If ALMS race management doesnt suck I dont know what does.

Teams that cannot win are abundant is motorsports. Not being a student of statistics I will take a wild stab that a team that cannot win in GA would win 1 race out of 50. A team that cannot win in ALMS would win 1 out of 250. SWC maybe 1 in 100.

But at least these teams that cannot win can lead, and occasionally show brillance...I have not seen that in ALMS because there is a car no one can beat on a race by race basis. How can you think that is healthy?

Any dyed in the wool ALMS fan knows 2006 would have bene a struggle, its not a shock to us, its bring people like you into the light. Its not really as bad as you make it out to be.

IMSA has done what they felt they needed to do -

Bring the MC12 over because Risi wanted the car

Give Acemco the things ACO took away because now that the Saleen is available to the general public has a street car, you can have the big wing back. Only to take it away again later, but IMSA gave it back after they announced they wouldn't be going to Le Mans.

IMSA is doing what they should be doing.

Not everybody can win, but you can be competitive, no matter what series you run.

I am versed with the numbers and I can tell you, that only 5 have won since 2004. That means more than 80% of the races ran have been won by either Suntrust/Riley or Ganassi Racing.

Nobody told Brumos they had to run the Porsche flat-six. That's just old-school thinking. Brumos knows Posches, fine but does Grand Am have to help them? No, but they did and that makes a series better than another?

I don't think so.

It didn't help them ONE bit, they haven't visited victory lane since 2003 and have hardly led a race.

Ricky Carmicheal won the AMA Supercross championship with Honda, he switch to Suzuki and the results are about the same.

Give any of those middle of the road Grand Am teams an Audi R8 and they wouldn't be any more competitive with Dyson or Champion.

Its just that simple.

Bell has only WON when Jim Bell NEVER DROVE the car or had limited time in the car. When your leading and you give up 2 seconds a lap to the other cars, you can't afford to have his novice arse in the car if you expect to win.

Sports is about winning first and being in position to win second.

Auto Racing is no different than Football..

Its a team sport and that means every phase has to be good or taken seriously.

If that cost more than you want to spend, maybe you should run elswhere, but that doesn't make Grand American better ran than IMSA/ALMS.

I'll use Dale White of Peterson/WhiteLighting Racing as an example..

He runs ONE Porsche 911 GT3 RSR.

He's won Le Mans, and been in the hunt for race victories every since entered the ALMS.

Are they complaining about how much AJR has won in the series? Let's not forget AJR was winning alot before they became the offical postor child for Porsche. You don't get that way without being GOOD to start with.

The problem with the owners over in Grand Am, these rich guys wanted to run in the fastest class. They could have choosen to run a Lola EX275/AER like Dyson does it doesn't cost anymore to do so.

But because some people talked them into that BS "Buy American" montra, they are over in GA.

The fact is the English have built better chassis for a long time. Why do you think Penske had his chassis shop over there? Because in that neck of the woods, everybody is building F1, F2 or F3 chassis. That's why, who's Crawford surrounded by?

Riley located near Indy doesn't translate into a better car either.

While it looks like you can do it, you can't just jump into this level of competition and expect to win, but that's what people like Krohn and Bell think.

I never understood lowering the bar for lesser teams, how about your raise your level of investement.

In the end Grand American is going to have basically the same problem. When Ganassi and Riley just have flat out better prepared cars, better prepared teams and faster pit stops, no amount of on-track performance is going to make the other teams better unless they do the same things.

All Spec racing does it take money that would be invested in the car's drivetrain and put it into where it can make the most difference.

How do you put cost control on better team management, better drivers and just flat being better period?

I just don't get it...

These threads are useless.

and I am brillant, I'm 3-0 early this college football season.

and in case your wondering, take Miami and the UNDER on Monday Night...

[kbeech]

The ole wait and see stuff coming from the ALMS managment is getting a old. I'll continue to watch this series, but I don't see much of a future for it. As for GARRA, large car counts, growing crowds, and increased ratings on SpeedTV (which I question). GARRA isn't going anywhere, but if it winds up the only sportscar series left in the US, I'll simply watch something else. I've tried to get into it, but I just can't. ISC/NASCAR has to much influence and I'm just tired of that Daytona bunch.

[dj4monie]

Originally Posted by kbeech

The ole wait and see stuff coming from the ALMS managment is getting a old. I'll continue to watch this series, but I don't see much of a future for it. As for GARRA, large car counts, growing crowds, and increased ratings on SpeedTV (which I question). GARRA isn't going anywhere, but if it winds up the only sportscar series left in the US, I'll simply watch something else. I've tried to get into it, but I just can't. ISC/NASCAR has to much influence and I'm just tired of that Daytona bunch.

Man I feel you, but I have never been waiting.

So there's nothing for me to be tired of.

When people want to run Le Mans and be competitive they'll come back to ALMS.

I think there several reasons that Grand Am exist, one of them is "buy america" another is "cost" and yet another is "employ your own" and "gentlemen racers should be involved on the track" but the fact remains they are always getting beaten by teams with professional drivers full time in the car.

Grand Am will run into the same problem they had when everybody had Porsche 962's. Al Holbert and Derek Bell were just better than everybody else. When Al died, it opened the door for Electromotive and they dominated.

They were that good, Nissan supported Electromotive and TWR was over here with basically the same cars they beat Porsche with in the V-12 Jags. Electromotive beat them straight up...

Then when Nissan dropped its program, AAR was just getting to terms with its car and they dominated, Thus ending the GTP era with a wimper...

In time one chassis/engine combination and driver combo is going to dominate Grand American Rolex and then what are they going to do??

Ganassi has been threatening to win back to back driver's and team titles and I don't hear the Grand Am backers screaming about that? I would call that domination wouldnt you?

I mean Dyson doesn't just ROLL over and let Audi beat them....

I don't expect other teams in Grand Am to LET them win it, but they most likely will because I feel they are the best team owned by the best car owner in the paddock.

So Grand Am despite is increases in patisaption (sp?) is growing in quanity and not quality.

[TheNewBob]

Originally Posted by billnchristy

If ALMS race management doesnt suck I dont know what does.

If your so adamant that it's really that bad, what's the point in trying to tell it to so many people who certainly don't share your point of view? Shouldn't you be telling it to the ALMS authorities instead? You'll probably be ignored, as you probably would with the organisers of any racing series. But it's just as much of a waste of time telling (and arguing with) die hard fans who know that the ALMS is making just as important a contribution to global sportscar racing as the Europeans are too.

They are very different series with very different goals. So maybe it doesn't satisfy your motor racing needs. Maybe you have a problem with the ALMS management. Like I said, take it up with them.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by kbeech

The ole wait and see stuff coming from the ALMS managment is getting a old. I'll continue to watch this series, but I don't see much of a future for it. .

How many more times!

This 'wait and see' mantra has always been related to the new LMP regs. The ALMS is 2 years behind the LMES in this respect so 2006 is THE year to look forward to.

[LouisTheShark]

"If teams over there were serious people like Duno or any of the gentlemen driver's wouldn't be in the cars period...That alone shows you the level of competition when you compare series."

When she drove regularly in the ALMS, she was loved. I guess this is the same as before, when Dyson and Field where in Grand Am, they were hated, now they are the toast of the town. Privateers are the backbone of the sport. No sports car series has ever survived any period of time without the backing of privateer entries, period.

"Bell has only WON when Jim Bell NEVER DROVE the car or had limited time in the car. When your leading and you give up 2 seconds a lap to the other cars, you can't afford to have his novice arse in the car if you expect to win"

I would hope Jim Bell never drives the car in anger.

"The problem with the owners over in Grand Am, these rich guys wanted to run in the fastest class. They could have choosen to run a Lola EX275/AER like Dyson does it doesn't cost anymore to do so."

I hope you don't believe that. If you do, you are really clueless about the differences in the cost of racing the two series.

"The fact is the English have built better chassis for a long time."

How quick we forget the Reynard 2KQ

"Why do you think Penske had his chassis shop over there? Because in that neck of the woods, everybody is building F1, F2 or F3 chassis. That's why, who's Crawford surrounded by?"

NASCAR

"Riley located near Indy doesn't translate into a better car either."

Wasn't the R&S MKiii one of the most succesful race cars during the 90s?

"While it looks like you can do it, you can't just jump into this level of competition and expect to win, but that's what people like Krohn and Bell think."

I assume you are talking about the Jim Bell from Bell Motorsports who is also the engineer on the Acemco Saleen, right?

"How do you put cost control on better team management, better drivers and just flat being better period?"

You don't and that was never the intend in Grand Am.

"I think there several reasons that Grand Am exist, one of them is "buy america" another is "cost" and yet another is "employ your own" and "gentlemen racers should be involved on the track" but the fact remains they are always getting beaten by teams with professional drivers full time in the car."

Gentleman racers are the backbone of sports car racing. Take those out of the ALMS today, you would loose about half the grid at Mosport. You may wish to research that "are always beaten" comment, because that statement is not true.

"In time one chassis/engine combination and driver combo is going to dominate Grand American Rolex and then what are they going to do??"

As you pointed out the 962 dominated for many years and the factory backed teams dominated that. Yet there were a lot of 962s run by privateers because the car was reliable and competitive even with the factory cars and there was U.S. based support.

"Ganassi has been threatening to win back to back driver's and team titles and I don't hear the Grand Am backers screaming about that? I would call that domination wouldnt you?"

SunTrust has won four races this year with one car, Ganassi has won two with two cars, Howard Boss (Crawford) has won 3 with two cars, and TRG has won one race with two cars. Last year the Rolex Series championship wasn't decided until the last race, while in the ALMS the P1 champion was decided at round 7 of 9. I don't think anyone will every deny that some teams spend more time at the top of the podium than others, but there is a lot more parity in the Rolex Series than in the ALMS.

"I mean Dyson doesn't just ROLL over and let Audi beat them.... I don't expect other teams in Grand Am to LET them win it, but they most likely will because I feel they are the best team owned by the best car owner in the paddock."

What are you saying here? I am confused. You believe that some DP teams roll over but not let the top cars win? Either they roll over or they don't. What is it?

[JAG]

I can't possibly make this any clearer.

I have no interest in Grand Am whatsoever. Its background TV at best.

If the ALMS dissapeared, I wouldn't switch my allegience to GA, I'd simply continue following LMES, FIA GT, DTM, WRC etc.

GA interests me as much as NASCAR, IRL, Trans-Am, dirt track racing, you name it.

If the US scene cannot support a series for what I consider 'real' sportscars (which I don't believe for one minute) thats too bad for you guys. Just don't try and convince me that NASCAR Spec sportscars are a worthy replacement for LMPs and GT1's.

Enjoy your series, its the polar opposite to the ALMS scene. At best they can run side by side, but GA can never replace ALMS, and vice versa.

[dj4monie]

Originally Posted by LouisTheShark

"If teams over there were serious people like Duno or any of the gentlemen driver's wouldn't be in the cars period...That alone shows you the level of competition when you compare series."

When she drove regularly in the ALMS, she was loved. I guess this is the same as before, when Dyson and Field where in Grand Am, they were hated, now they are the toast of the town. Privateers are the backbone of the sport. No sports car series has ever survived any period of time without the backing of privateer entries, period.

"Bell has only WON when Jim Bell NEVER DROVE the car or had limited time in the car. When your leading and you give up 2 seconds a lap to the other cars, you can't afford to have his novice arse in the car if you expect to win"

I would hope Jim Bell never drives the car in anger.

"The problem with the owners over in Grand Am, these rich guys wanted to run in the fastest class. They could have choosen to run a Lola EX275/AER like Dyson does it doesn't cost anymore to do so."

I hope you don't believe that. If you do, you are really clueless about the differences in the cost of racing the two series.

"The fact is the English have built better chassis for a long time."

How quick we forget the Reynard 2KQ

"Why do you think Penske had his chassis shop over there? Because in that neck of the woods, everybody is building F1, F2 or F3 chassis. That's why, who's Crawford surrounded by?"

NASCAR

"Riley located near Indy doesn't translate into a better car either."

Wasn't the R&S MKiii one of the most succesful race cars during the 90s?

"While it looks like you can do it, you can't just jump into this level of competition and expect to win, but that's what people like Krohn and Bell think."

I assume you are talking about the Jim Bell from Bell Motorsports who is also the engineer on the Acemco Saleen, right?

"How do you put cost control on better team management, better drivers and just flat being better period?"

You don't and that was never the intend in Grand Am.

"I think there several reasons that Grand Am exist, one of them is "buy america" another is "cost" and yet another is "employ your own" and "gentlemen racers should be involved on the track" but the fact remains they are always getting beaten by teams with professional drivers full time in the car."

Gentleman racers are the backbone of sports car racing. Take those out of the ALMS today, you would loose about half the grid at Mosport. You may wish to research that "are always beaten" comment, because that statement is not true.

"In time one chassis/engine combination and driver combo is going to dominate Grand American Rolex and then what are they going to do??"

As you pointed out the 962 dominated for many years and the factory backed teams dominated that. Yet there were a lot of 962s run by privateers because the car was reliable and competitive even with the factory cars and there was U.S. based support.

"Ganassi has been threatening to win back to back driver's and team titles and I don't hear the Grand Am backers screaming about that? I would call that domination wouldnt you?"

SunTrust has won four races this year with one car, Ganassi has won two with two cars, Howard Boss (Crawford) has won 3 with two cars, and TRG has won one race with two cars. Last year the Rolex Series championship wasn't decided until the last race, while in the ALMS the P1 champion was decided at round 7 of 9. I don't think anyone will every deny that some teams spend more time at the top of the podium than others, but there is a lot more parity in the Rolex Series than in the ALMS.

"I mean Dyson doesn't just ROLL over and let Audi beat them.... I don't expect other teams in Grand Am to LET them win it, but they most likely will because I feel they are the best team owned by the best car owner in the paddock."

What are you saying here? I am confused. You believe that some DP teams roll over but not let the top cars win? Either they roll over or they don't. What is it?

From what I understand Jim Bell of Bell Motorsports came from racing boats before racing cars. Just going off what I heard in 2003. Are we talking about the same person?

Don't put words in my mouth, Duno was OKAY when she ran in the Panoz/Mugen car, but then again that car had several issues, least of which was who was driving it.

Again what your telling me is that Dyson has more money than some of the teams that run Grand Am. I can't believe that, what Dyson has been is more sucessful.

Racing off-shore boats as Jill Bell was doing is hardly cheap. The guy that owns Boss makes snow plows and get help from Citgo. All of the DP teams have some sort of sponsorship, I think its easy to compare that most ALMS teams are doing it out of their own pocket, like Dyson, like Acemco, like Flying Lizard and J3.

Again your trying to say that these guys have less money than Rob Dyson does?

Seems to me they are about equal. It cost more to RUN ALMS, but it the cars themselves your talking about maybe a 10-15K difference and although Im not rich, as I understand it, when your checking account has 7 digits in it, spending 10-15K more isn't that big of a deal.

The Reynard is one of several badly engineered English race cars, but what has America done lately????

NASCAR teams spend more time with shocks, engines and overall team performance than they do with chassis design. Trust me... There only so many things you can do with a tube chassis under NASCAR rules.

The Riley R&S was successful here and only here. Wayne Taylor took those Danka/Olds Auroa powered R&S's over to Le Mans and got waxed. RS was embarssed by Audi and BMW, who might have spent more money overall, but the Caddy wasn't only UNDERPOWERED, but didn't turn or brake very well either and was beaten by Don Panoz.

Again, when you talk sportscars you cannot talk about just the US because and nobody has done anything to break the strangle hold on open wheel and sportscar chassis by the UK.

All of our best people are working in Nextel Cup....

Please -

Seth Nieman is one of the FEW owner/drivers actually driving a car in ALMS and you notice where that car runs?

Mike Peterson and Dale White haven't driven the car in almost two years, so what are you talking about?

When the stakes were raised, these guys upped the ante and didn't complain. Of course it helps when Porsche gives you drivers to use, lord knows how many they can spare...

Confused at what?

Last time I looked, yes I'm black but there wasn't any ebonics or any other ghetto lingo that would go over your head, so what about that last sentence that didn't make sense???

Errors and Points Taken Louis, the Shark???

[billnchristy]

Thats actually forrest barber. The owner of the Bell Motorsports car...Jim Bell has never driven the car.

As for Krohn, he already has a win in his first season in the Riley...about a 100% increase in performance in the ALMS.