If MS was out of the first 9 races,

ttc · 2 Jul 2004, 15:21 (Ref:1023812)

say due to DNFs or whatsnot, how many think that RB will be able to carry Ferrari as dominantly as MS had.

1) Australia (MS 1st, RB 2nd, FA 3rd, RS 4th)
2) Malaysia (MS 1st, JPM 2nd, JB 3rd, RB 4th)
3) Bahrain (MS 1st, RB 2nd, JB 3rd, JT 4th)
4) San Marino (MS 1st, JB 2nd, JPM 3rd, FA 4th)
5) Spain (MS 1st, RB 2nd, JT 3rd, FA 4th)
6) Monaco (JT 1st, JB 2nd, RB 3rd, JPM 4th)
7) Europe (MS 1st, RB 2nd, JB 3rd, JT 4th)
8) Canada (MS 1st, RB 2nd, JB 3rd, GF 4th)
9) USA (MS 1st, RB 2nd, TS 3rd, JT 4th)

Let's hear it and why you believe so, ok?

And let's leave all the snipes and insults to some other thread, shall we?

Kicking-back · 2 Jul 2004, 15:24 (Ref:1023815)

He'd clearly be leading the championship.

Liz · 2 Jul 2004, 17:50 (Ref:1023915)

Compare to the time when TGF was not available and Irvine nearly won the championship... and then as soon as TGF returned, Irvine began to have botched pit stops, brake trouble and even a missing tire.

Yes, if TGF were not available at all, RB would be winning races, but he would never be allowed to win a Ferrari championship while TGF was alive.

Kicking-back · 2 Jul 2004, 17:54 (Ref:1023921)

It's not a case of him not being allowed - he's simply not quick enough.

**Adam43** · 2 Jul 2004, 18:03 (Ref:1023932)

OK this is a IF thread, but lets not go down the old injustice of it all. We know what is going on at Ferrari (or what we want to know), but this thread isn't about that. All those others are.

Wrex · 2 Jul 2004, 18:41 (Ref:1023968)

K-B, you have been here long enough to know logic is a silly basis for an argument for the bashers!

Kicking-back · 2 Jul 2004, 18:43 (Ref:1023969)

Quote:

Originally posted by Wrex
K-B, you have been here long enough to know logic is a silly basis for an argument for the bashers!

Very true!

It never ceases to amaze me how they can take it so seriously.

Logic doesn't work, humour doesn't work either.

Probably best to get them drunk....

Mr V · 2 Jul 2004, 19:23 (Ref:1024003)

Quote:

Originally posted by Liz
Compare to the time when TGF was not available and Irvine nearly won the championship... and then as soon as TGF returned, Irvine began to have botched pit stops, brake trouble and even a missing tire.

The race you are talking about happened whilst Michael was still on the sidelines!

BARrouette · 2 Jul 2004, 20:17 (Ref:1024048)

R.B. would kick everyone arss. Well almost any good driver would lead the championship with a Ferrari.

Logrence · 2 Jul 2004, 21:36 (Ref:1024109)

I don't know if he could handle the pressure psychologically - he's driving at his peak at the moment purely because there's no pressure - nothing is expected of him because Michael is the one doing all the winning.

He's so relaxed, and the Ferrari team are so relaxed - it's hard to imagine how they'd fare in other circumstances.

Gt_R · 3 Jul 2004, 02:11 (Ref:1024243)

Yes, RB is a very good driver and he'd be leading the WDC now if MS isn't around (given the car is as good as it is now)- but the leading gap in points would be smaller, and maybe one or two race wins less.

What is important is, can RB keep the momentum of Ferrari going when MS suddenly sits out 9 races. MS's influence and impact on the team is undeniable and strong...and without him, we'd probably see a Ferrari which strong as it is, sway off track on occassions.

alfasud · 3 Jul 2004, 03:09 (Ref:1024260)

Just looking at the numbers (current points):

M.SCHUMACHER 10 10 10 10 10 - 10 10 10 = 80
BARRICHELLO 8 5 8 3 8 6 8 8 8 = 62
BUTTON 3 6 6 8 1 8 6 6 - = 44
TRULLI 2 4 5 4 6 10 5 - 5 = 41
ALONSO 6 2 3 5 5 - 4 - - = 25
MONTOYA 4 8 - 6 - 5 1 - - = 24

Michael leads by 18 points.

Now lets remove Michael and redistribute those points. In other words, all those that finished behind Michael move up one spot for that race.

BARRICHELLO 10 6 10 4 10 6 10 10 10 = 76
BUTTON 4 8 8 10 2 8 8 8 - = 56
TRULLI 3 5 6 5 8 10 6 - 6 = 49
ALONSO 8 3 4 6 6 - 5 - - = 32
MONTOYA 5 10 - 8 - 6 2 - - = 31

Please correct me if I've made any errors, but it would appear that Rubens would lead the championship by 20 points [Edit: of course the closest non-Ferrari is a little closer than before].

Now we could argue for weeks on end about the impact on Michaels problems ... would the team be demoralised and produce worse results for Rubens or would Rubens find better performance as his confidence improved by leading the championship?

However just looking at the results, the answer has to be yes.

Wrex · 3 Jul 2004, 04:25 (Ref:1024326)

Good work alfasud, but if Michael was'nt there, Webber or Alonso or someone else would be there.

Meroo · 3 Jul 2004, 07:48 (Ref:1024433)

I'm afraid Rubens is a born No.2.

Don K · 3 Jul 2004, 08:53 (Ref:1024485)

If Michael would have missed the first 9 races, Rubens would be leading the championship by now.
Rubens would not be as dominant as Michael is.
But he might have similar gaps in the WDC as Michael has.

And the second Ferrari driver would certainly be somewhere in the top-5.
If the second Ferrari driver would be good enough to score podiums on a regular basis, Rubens would have a big gap to the nearest non-Ferrari driver.
If the second Ferrari driver would not be good enough to score podiums, he would be replaced after about 4 races.

If Michael would come back in the 10th race, he would have to help Rubens secure the WDC and the WCC for Ferrari.
After that, he would probably win the rest of the races.

Wrex · 3 Jul 2004, 09:23 (Ref:1024507)

Why is that Don? He could probably skip 1-10 and still win the WDC himself

Don K · 3 Jul 2004, 17:37 (Ref:1025045)

Quote:

Originally posted by Wrex
Why is that Don? He could probably skip 1-10 and still win the WDC himself

If he would enter the championship with only 9 races to go, he could not get more than 90 points.
And some of the other drivers might end up with more than 90 points.

If at that point Rubens would have a 30 point lead in the WDC, and Ferrari had a (let's say) 20 point lead in the WCC, neither of the championships would have been decided yet.

If Rubens wins a race with Michael finishing second, the lead in the WDC would increase with 4-6 points and the lead in the WCC would increase with 7-13 points.

After about 5 races, both championships would have been decided.
And at that point, Michael still wouldn't have won a single race.
So from that point onwards, the complete team would be working to let Michael win some races.
And Michael would probably end the championship with less than 80 points.

Kicking-back · 3 Jul 2004, 17:51 (Ref:1025053)

Don!

He was joking

**garcon** · 3 Jul 2004, 20:36 (Ref:1025159)

I think at this stage Rubens would certainly be leading.

But without Michael's sheer psychological drive to keep the Ferrari team on their toes, I suspect there would be Williams, Macs, Renaults and BARs snapping at his heels ready to pounce at the season's end.

gert · 3 Jul 2004, 20:42 (Ref:1025167)

Depends upon who would be there in Michael's place.

Wrex · 4 Jul 2004, 02:21 (Ref:1025309)

Quote:

Originally posted by Kicking-back
Don!

He was joking

Yes

Well ...

Sort of

Mekola · 5 Jul 2004, 01:53 (Ref:1026284)

Quote:

Originally posted by Meroo
I'm afraid Rubens is a born No.2.

That can be as a FERRARI No.2, but Rubens was a clear Number One driver when he drove for Jordan (despite some intents of Irvine to dispute his role) and Stewart.

ttc · 5 Jul 2004, 04:28 (Ref:1026344)

Quote:

Originally posted by Mekola
That can be as a FERRARI No.2, but Rubens was a clear Number One driver when he drove for Jordan (despite some intents of Irvine to dispute his role) and Stewart.

You mean... (gasping for air) you mean... Jordan and Stewart have No. 1 and No. 2 drivers???!

Gawd, reading this forum, it would seems only the "evil red empire" has a No. 1 and No. 2 drivers policy...

P.S. You just know I gotta get that out of my system, don't you?

View Poll Results: If MS was out of the first 9 races, will RB be able to carry Ferrari similarly?
Yes, most definitely!	12	44.44%
No, most definitely!	9	33.33%
Maybe, maybe not	6	22.22%
Voters: 27. You may not vote on this poll

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