LMS Rnd 6: Interlagos 1000km 9-11 Nov 2007

[Justin Moran]

Could be the ACO thinking "we can do this and sucssessfully, whereas the FIA cant!"

May not be the reason but it sounds probable?

[cmk]

Originally Posted by C9/89

Could be the ACO thinking "we can do this and sucssessfully, whereas the FIA cant!"

May not be the reason but it sounds probable?

What is ironic is the degree of commonality between the organizing bodies of the two series. I mean, who did the people involved think they would be upstaging by pulling off an LMS race at Interlagos? Themselves?

PLM would have been a cracking last round. Flyaway, yes. Expensive, yes. Exciting and well-attended by people and local teams, yes. Maybe only genuine title contenders would have showed up, just like Brazil will probably see them too, but it would have made logical sense. The cream of the European crop dices with the quality ALMS field for the right to call themselves LMS champions. Sounds good to me... The field would likely have been VERY strong, too. 'All killer, no filler'.

[JAG]

I think the only viable fly away event is Japan with the JLMC and plenty of potential pay drivers/general interest.

[cmk]

Originally Posted by JAG

I think the only viable fly away event is Japan with the JLMC and plenty of potential pay drivers/general interest.

If this is the case, then why does the JLMC remain an embarrassing excuse for a race series?

[ThePenguin]

Originally Posted by cmk

If this is the case, then why does the JLMC remain an embarrassing excuse for a race series?

Two words: Super GT

[cmk]

Originally Posted by ThePenguin

Two words: Super GT

Rather the point I was making, albeit not directly. There is a lack of general interest in ACO-style racing in Japan because they already have an enjoyable sportscar alternative of their own. I don't predict that it would make a better audience for an LMS flyaway than the US, which already has a decent body of ACO-rules (there or thereabouts) contestants that would guarantee a good 'base' field to fill out the grid in the event (inevitability?) of lower LMS attendance.

[ThePenguin]

Originally Posted by cmk

Rather the point I was making, albeit not directly. There is a lack of general interest in ACO-style racing in Japan because they already have an enjoyable sportscar alternative of their own. I don't predict that it would make a better audience for an LMS flyaway than the US, which already has a decent body of ACO-rules (there or thereabouts) contestants that would guarantee a good 'base' field to fill out the grid in the event (inevitability?) of lower LMS attendance.

Well then maybe you should be more direct next time.

[cmk]

Originally Posted by ThePenguin

Well then maybe you should be more direct next time.

I'm a scientist, I get enough of being direct in my day job to make me nauseous!

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by cmk

What is ironic is the degree of commonality between the organizing bodies of the two series. I mean, who did the people involved think they would be upstaging by pulling off an LMS race at Interlagos? Themselves?

Yes it would be quite fantastic to see SRO give SRO a black eye!!

PLM would have been a cracking last round. Flyaway, yes. Expensive, yes. Exciting and well-attended by people and local teams, yes. Maybe only genuine title contenders would have showed up, just like Brazil will probably see them too, but it would have made logical sense. The cream of the European crop dices with the quality ALMS field for the right to call themselves LMS champions. Sounds good to me... The field would likely have been VERY strong, too. 'All killer, no filler'.

Biased of course, but I believe PLM would be the perfect flyaway season finale for the LMS.

L.P.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by cmk

If this is the case, then why does the JLMC remain an embarrassing excuse for a race series?

Because it's an upstart series up against Super GT.

Now the ACO are taking the reigns I have little doubt it'll be a great series in years to come. The FIA SCC was struggling like the JLMC before the ACO/LMS series came on the scene.

Super GT has more in common with the old Group A touring car series than LMS/Group C, there's room for both.

[brielga]

PLM for the LMS/ALMS combination would be just...glorious and less expensive than Interlagos! However Interlagos could have worked renting out seats to the stars of Brazilian Stock Cars and Argentinian TC2000. Plenty of well-known international names, sponsorship and will/ability to race at top level.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Biased of course, but I believe PLM would be the perfect flyaway season finale for the LMS.

It just wouldn't be feasible. Maximum entries would be 50 something. How can you have a points scoring race, where you might need to reject certain entries?

[The Badger]

I think the idea of a fly-away round sounds ok but , I dont think its really needed . The ACO should drop the idea infuture cuz of apparent lack of interest and also lack of travel money support .

There is enough tracks in Europe to support the European LMS series . The ALMS and Jananese series doesnt have fly-away rounds , so why should the ACO expect European teams to want to travel ?

The idea sounds wonderful , but as we see it doesnt work ?

Whats wrong with Brno for next year for example , possibily pit spaces ?

[TWK]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

It just wouldn't be feasible. Maximum entries would be 50 something. How can you have a points scoring race, where you might need to reject certain entries?

Maximum entries permitted under FIA license for a multi-class international-calendar race at Road Atlanta is 52. Still, you can have a points-scoring event if it comes at the end of the season - much like a "play off," everyone need not participate.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by TWK

Maximum entries permitted under FIA license for a multi-class international-calendar race at Road Atlanta is 52. Still, you can have a points-scoring event if it comes at the end of the season - much like a "play off," everyone need not participate.

So your suggestion, is for the LMS to adopt the Chase?

[Tim Northcutt]

Personally, I would like to see an "All-Star" event in which the Top Five in points in each of the four classes from ALMS and LMS would be invited (approx. 40 thus far) plus give the promoter addtional "Wild Cards" from either series to invite to get up to 50 competitors....

There are a few glitches, like only two GT1 cars in ALMS right now, but that would leave more room for wild cards from other classes...like the LMP2 class in ALMS...to compete....or others from Europe....

Then have DHL or an international shipper provide transport for the teams in return for making them a "Title Sponsor" of the event.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

Personally, I would like to see an "All-Star" event in which the Top Five in points in each of the four classes from ALMS and LMS would be invited (approx. 40 thus far) plus give the promoter addtional "Wild Cards" from either series to invite to get up to 50 competitors....

There are a few glitches, like only two GT1 cars in ALMS right now, but that would leave more room for wild cards from other classes...like the LMP2 class in ALMS...to compete....or others from Europe....

Then have DHL or an international shipper provide transport for the teams in return for making them a "Title Sponsor" of the event.

Isn't that called Le Mans, just without the corporate sponsorship/title sponsor? I know it's the middle-ish of the season but I have always looked at LM as the all-stars of both series together. But having the LMS teams join with the ALMS at PLM as the season ending race would be a great end for both series and a teaser of the next season. Interlagos just doesn't seem to have the desire, even in the eyes of fans, to fill a field and get a competitive event worthy of the costs necessary.
(an aside, has anybody else had a problem with Firefox 2.0.0.7 and stability with the banner ads here, get it locking up if I let pages load all the way.)

[jhansen]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

Personally, I would like to see an "All-Star" event in which the Top Five in points in each of the four classes from ALMS and LMS would be invited (approx. 40 thus far) plus give the promoter addtional "Wild Cards" from either series to invite to get up to 50 competitors....

There are a few glitches, like only two GT1 cars in ALMS right now, but that would leave more room for wild cards from other classes...like the LMP2 class in ALMS...to compete....or others from Europe....

Then have DHL or an international shipper provide transport for the teams in return for making them a "Title Sponsor" of the event.

It's a good sounding plan. But something tells me that DHL aren't exactly jumping at the chance. 'Official Transportor of Le Mans' has a certain ring to it (and great exposure). However, when you add that tag to some non-descript never run before all-star race it leaves a lot to be desired. Cost vs. return does not flesh this one out I'm afraid. If it did, international sportscar racing would have done it already. But, I could be wrong...

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Isn't that called Le Mans, just without the corporate sponsorship/title sponsor? I know it's the middle-ish of the season but I have always looked at LM as the all-stars of both series together.

I would tend to agree with that to.

[Tim Northcutt]

Originally Posted by jhansen

It's a good sounding plan. But something tells me that DHL aren't exactly jumping at the chance. 'Official Transportor of Le Mans' has a certain ring to it (and great exposure). However, when you add that tag to some non-descript never run before all-star race it leaves a lot to be desired. Cost vs. return does not flesh this one out I'm afraid. If it did, international sportscar racing would have done it already. But, I could be wrong...




I would tend to agree with that to.

No...It really isn't the same....

For LM, automatic bids go to the LMS and ALMS season class champs only plus the class podium finishers at Le Mans the year before and the Petit LM class winners.

Half of the field are invites and the ALMS gets a lot less invites than the European teams receive. Sebring results didn't even figure into the equation last year.

In recent years, the ACO has extended invites to teams that were virtual vaporware (Spinnaker Clandesteam, anyone?) and had to insert many of their alternates.

Does anyone really think that the Norma, the Taurus Lola Diesel, or even the revised Reynard chassis that was made into a hybrid that originally used an ethanol-powered Cosworth engine (the team's name escapes me at the moment) was one of the "best" sportscars in the world and worthy of participating at Le Mans, let alone in an "All Star" event?

I sure don't think so....all three were woefully uncompetitive at LM and they held spots on the grid while others who deserved bids were left at home.

This would reward teams for their results on the track during the season.

This would be a post-season event (held in a warm climate) that would reward those who succeeded, plus some teams who were competitive, but did not make the Top Five in their class (like AGR stands right now, or other good teams in LMS probably stand).

I'd rather see what would arguably be the 50 best sportscar teams in the world compete in a second event to climax the season....who knows...It might even provide better racing that we see at Le Mans...

JMHO

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

or even the revised Reynard chassis that was made into a hybrid that originally used an ethanol-powered Cosworth engine (the team's name escapes me at the moment)

Team Nasamax was the team in question , if i remember correctly Tim .

[Tim Northcutt]

Thank you...I couldn't recall their name

[brielga]

Mr B. you are right and they're still alive and threaten to come back, just like the WR (now in Diester dressing). I still think a "Masters of Sportscars" event would be a perfect icing to the cake, Sebring and that one on the edges, LM in the middle of the season.... what about that?

[Mal]

Originally Posted by brielga

Mr B. you are right and they're still alive and threaten to come back, just like the WR (now in Diester dressing). I still think a "Masters of Sportscars" event would be a perfect icing to the cake, Sebring and that one on the edges, LM in the middle of the season.... what about that?

Le Mans needs to remain a stand alone event.

But a season finale bringing together the winners of LMS, ALMS and hopefully JLMS (if it gets stronger) would be a great idea. Making PLM that event makes a lot of sense.

[Kai]

I think that Dubai or Bahrain would be a much more viable option for the LMS to hold a non-European round at. The costs involved with getting the cars there would be considerably less than a flyaway race to the Americas.

[brielga]

Originally Posted by Kai

I think that Dubai or Bahrain would be a much more viable option for the LMS to hold a non-European round at. The costs involved with getting the cars there would be considerably less than a flyaway race to the Americas.

Another race with empty grandstands?? No, thanks