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Old 4 Jun 2024, 00:30 (Ref:4211710)   #76
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Originally Posted by one five five View Post
The speedcafe story about said article (do they do any original content story these days?) mentions existing investors chucking in more money…..
That word
In-vest-ors

I wonder what it means?

And what they do for businesses on a daily basis?
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 00:39 (Ref:4211711)   #77
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RACE Loses $20 million!!!

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Old 4 Jun 2024, 00:43 (Ref:4211713)   #78
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Originally Posted by Mixer View Post
That word
In-vest-ors

I wonder what it means?

And what they do for businesses on a daily basis?
Quote:
Originally Posted by the Speedcafe Article

Canberra-based property developer Jure Domazet, one of the existing shareholders, is thought to have injected more capital into the business at some point in 2023
Mr Domazet’s Enterprise
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 01:09 (Ref:4211716)   #79
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EBITDA is shorthand for cash flow.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 01:37 (Ref:4211719)   #80
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Originally Posted by Mixer View Post
That word
In-vest-ors

I wonder what it means?

And what they do for businesses on a daily basis?
They invested their money when they bought it didn’t they?

Surely by now they’d have expected Supercars as a business to be paying for itself, not having to keep tipping their own money in

Like I said, is Supercars a business or a passion project for “in-vest-ors” to play with their money?
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 01:45 (Ref:4211720)   #81
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Businesses need investment all the time.

They didn't go to a loan shark or get caught shipping drugs in a container, they implemented a costly new platform and took on investment from within without fanfare.

It happens every day in businesses all around the world. Just not news if you are not looking for a reason to be critical.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 01:51 (Ref:4211721)   #82
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do they do any original content story these days?
Broke the Kostecki story did they not?
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EBITDA is shorthand for cash flow.
EBITDA can be a more accurate measure of the current management's performance as it strips out costs that may have been incurred by a previous regime. Hence it is often the measurement used by companies when assessing bonuses.
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It happens every day in businesses all around the world. Just not news if you are not looking for a reason to be critical.
Exactly, it is only those seeking to sensationalise that think it is.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 02:00 (Ref:4211723)   #83
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Not that it is anything other than an anecdote but my business took on $800k in finance last year (to make my life easier), and I ONLY show a profit it I need finance.
Otherwise at tax time out comes the red pen to engineer a paper loss.
A company with shareholders can be sued if they don't do similarly.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 02:14 (Ref:4211724)   #84
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EBITDA is shorthand for cash flow.
No it isn’t. Not when there is significant change to the capital structure, as appears to be the case here. You need to see the Source & Application of Funds statement to see just how much was injected and/or financed into the entity. Or indeed repaid to investors or financiers.

Especially when RACE seems to have capitalised the cost of Gen3, including payments to teams.

I don’t quite know how RACE can front up to Governments Local, State & Federal with such horrible numbers, and the threat of insolvent trading without further investor injections…

Sad..

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Old 4 Jun 2024, 02:16 (Ref:4211726)   #85
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How can you say that establishment of Gen3 is not a Capex rather than Opex?
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 02:48 (Ref:4211727)   #86
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Originally Posted by GTRMagic View Post
No it isn’t. Not when there is significant change to the capital structure, as appears to be the case here. You need to see the Source & Application of Funds statement to see just how much was injected and/or financed into the entity. Or indeed repaid to investors or financiers.

Especially when RACE seems to have capitalised the cost of Gen3, including payments to teams.

I don’t quite know how RACE can front up to Governments Local, State & Federal with such horrible numbers, and the threat of insolvent trading without further investor injections…

Sad..

Yes, longhand not shorthand.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 02:58 (Ref:4211728)   #87
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mainstream business or the sports page ?

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The speedcafe story about said article (do they do any original content story these days?) mentions existing investors chucking in more money…..


Is Supercars a business or a passion project?
Reported as 'Sports Business' in mainstream media versus niche sport coverage.
Mainstream media GOOD !!!
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 03:42 (Ref:4211730)   #88
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Businesses need investment all the time.
Certainly. But based on these numbers is the investment needed to grow, or is investment needed to survive.

The business RACE bought is nearly 30 years old afterall. It shouldn’t be making a loss as for the same amount of time we’ve continually been told how racing is a business first, not a sport.

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They didn't go to a loan shark or get caught shipping drugs in a container, they implemented a costly new platform and took on investment from within without fanfare.
They are handed money every year from governments for their events. They can’t turn a profit even with these event handouts.

The costly new platform was their own doing, RACE pushed on with Gen3 themselves.

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It happens every day in businesses all around the world. Just not news if you are not looking for a reason to be critical.
You ripped ARG to shreds any chance you got about how they were at the whim of Boyd & McMellens interest and investment, yet here Supercars is at the same whim of whether the RACE shareholders want to invest further or not and you’re defending it. Pick an angle.

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Broke the Kostecki story did they not?
That was six months ago…….. (if you call being the only one willing to print what other outlets also knew “breaking the story”)
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 04:15 (Ref:4211731)   #89
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You ripped ARG to shreds any chance you got about how they were at the whim of Boyd & McMellens interest and investment, yet here Supercars is at the same whim of whether the RACE shareholders want to invest further or not and you’re defending it. Pick an angle.
Well, interesting you bring this up.

You're able to have this discussion about Supercars because they are completely transparent.

I never took any issue with Boyd & McMellan's huge investment in getting TCR off the ground - I admire them for it.

I take issue however with the carefully stage-managed and utterly false "ownership" stories out of places like the Kellys and Bright, not to mention many others. They lied to the entire market and COVID made the music stop.

They chose to directly and completely lie and try to manufacture an environment where people would buy into the frenzy and they could gradually reduce the funding and have the teams actually take over ownership, but that isn't what happened.

But COVID came, they had overextended themselves and had to focus on their businesses, so all the funding stopped, the Stan deal happened, many categories have left the ARG fold, and I think there are very valid questions of whether TCR can actually survive under ARG.

So it's an interesting comparison, really.

There are a great many businesses that require funding to operate at times, and as long as they can access funding and make their commitments, there's no issue with it.
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Old 4 Jun 2024, 07:50 (Ref:4211751)   #90
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How can you say that establishment of Gen3 is not a Capex rather than Opex?
Accounting standards would require that the Gen3 development costs be capitalised and amortised over the expected life of the platform.
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That was six months ago…….. (if you call being the only one willing to print what other outlets also knew “breaking the story”)
Other outlets claimed they knew of the story, yet decided to sit on it. Or dare I say that they didn't get the same mail that Speedcafe did and were blindsided like the rest of us.

Speedcafe was the one that first ran the story that forced the rushed co-ordinated Erebus / Supercars press releases. Other agencies either waited for the press releases or directly referred to the Speedcafe story. Of course no one agency is always going to be first with the news, but Speedcafe has had others, was first with the Tim Edwards leaving Tickford story another example.
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Old 5 Jun 2024, 05:35 (Ref:4211879)   #91
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It's normal for investors to invest.

Also normal for investors to seek a return - when does that happen?
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Old 5 Jun 2024, 08:15 (Ref:4211892)   #92
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It's normal for investors to invest.

Also normal for investors to seek a return - when does that happen?
The previous brand custodians seemed to manage ok...
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Old 6 Jun 2024, 01:36 (Ref:4211994)   #93
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The previous brand custodians seemed to manage ok...
If you compare the amount Archer paid for it compared to what they sold it for it looks like a money bonfire.
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