Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Single Seater Racing > Formula One

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 5 Jul 2023, 07:28 (Ref:4166781)   #51
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
Hopefully we will have less of a problem at Silverstone this weekend
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 08:41 (Ref:4166790)   #52
Taxi645
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Netherlands
Posts: 979
Taxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridTaxi645 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woolley View Post
So, something like grass. Preferably a bit bumpy so they a) know they're on it, b) don't want to be, and c) it slows them down when they are.

Just like Mid-Ohio. No track limits problems there.



Can't say I even understand that comment. What has 'woke' to do with anything? Odd.



I have long been a proponent of strips of grass on the outside of the kerb. On this track they want to facilitate MotoGP as. This could be a solution for that. Either make it reversible or add to plates on top of each other with a different friction coefficient that you can switch around depending on if cars or bikes are racing.
Taxi645 is offline  
__________________
Constructive discussion: A conversion where participants are maximally open to yet critical of each others (and their own) arguments, with the intend of enhancing the knowledge, understanding and/or handling of it's subject.
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 09:03 (Ref:4166792)   #53
Plantagenet
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
United Kingdom
Posts: 55
Plantagenet should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridPlantagenet should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridPlantagenet should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by S griffin View Post
Hopefully we will have less of a problem at Silverstone this weekend
I'm afraid that both Copse and the Maggots/Becketts/Chapel sequence will be highly liable for abuse. Hopefully my pessimism will prove to be misplaced.
Plantagenet is offline  
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 15:06 (Ref:4166833)   #54
TrapezeArtist
Veteran
 
TrapezeArtist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
United Kingdom
England
Posts: 1,872
TrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sodemo View Post
I don’t think it needs to be over complicated, a simple 3 metre minimum strip of grass at the track edge is all that is required in my opinion. You can then have tarmac after that or more grass or gravel. A thinner strip will just invite drivers to floor it over the strip and therefore be ineffective.
I agree it doesn't need to be complicated, although F1 is notorious for choosing a complicated solution over a simple one. I think 1m of grass may be enough, but if it needs to be 3m, I'm fine with that too.

If the grass is followed by tarmac run-off, it will require a lot of maintenance to prevent it forming a step at the transition onto the tarmac. Gravel will be easier.
TrapezeArtist is offline  
__________________
The older I get, the faster I was.
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 15:07 (Ref:4166834)   #55
TrapezeArtist
Veteran
 
TrapezeArtist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
United Kingdom
England
Posts: 1,872
TrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by crmalcolm View Post
How do you prevent the grass from becoming damaged and resulting in divots?
Stop people playing golf on it.
TrapezeArtist is offline  
__________________
The older I get, the faster I was.
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 15:08 (Ref:4166835)   #56
TrapezeArtist
Veteran
 
TrapezeArtist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
United Kingdom
England
Posts: 1,872
TrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sodemo View Post
Mix it with concrete? Is that grasscrete still a thing?
Grasscrete wouldn't work. It's supposed to have friction similar to concrete but look like grass. Like many compromises, it doesn't do either thing well.
TrapezeArtist is offline  
__________________
The older I get, the faster I was.
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 15:31 (Ref:4166839)   #57
TrapezeArtist
Veteran
 
TrapezeArtist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
United Kingdom
England
Posts: 1,872
TrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridTrapezeArtist should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plantagenet View Post
I'm afraid that both Copse and the Maggots/Becketts/Chapel sequence will be highly liable for abuse. Hopefully my pessimism will prove to be misplaced.
I'm optimistic that your pessimism is misplaced. The drivers should now understand the penalties for abuse. They are perfectly capable of driving within track limits. They've just lost the habit.
TrapezeArtist is offline  
__________________
The older I get, the faster I was.
Quote
Old 5 Jul 2023, 22:21 (Ref:4166893)   #58
Sodemo
Veteran
 
Sodemo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
United Kingdom
Solihull, West Mids, UK
Posts: 11,147
Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist View Post
Grasscrete wouldn't work. It's supposed to have friction similar to concrete but look like grass. Like many compromises, it doesn't do either thing well.
But as a deterrent for going wide it should work, no?
Sodemo is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 07:28 (Ref:4166914)   #59
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
Well that's the thing. Drivers have gone wide at corners, even when there's grass. Sometimes they've got away with it, sometimes they haven't, but at least they know there's a risk if they get it wrong there
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 07:38 (Ref:4166921)   #60
Aysedasi
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
 
Aysedasi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
England
Lymington, New Forest, England
Posts: 39,527
Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!
More than a risk. They need to be hit hard if they start doing it again. The first few penalties need to be severe enough to make that risk massively outweigh the benefit.
Aysedasi is offline  
__________________
96 days...
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 07:53 (Ref:4166928)   #61
Gerard C
Veteran
 
Gerard C's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
France
My place
Posts: 9,979
Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taxi645 View Post
Just put reservable 1 meter wide plating on the outside of the first kerb. One side is tarmac or tarmac equal friction coefficient so the bikes have their safe track limit. The other side is a very low friction coefficient sort of astroturf surface. If you go on it, you will definitely lose time. You flip the plates depending on if you have a bike or car race. No need to store them anywhere, no need for an optical track limit system with penalties. If you go outside the wide line the track will punish you automatically.
Brilliant idea. Good to remind that some tracks are both homologated for F1 and Moto GP. As to the "other side" may be it could offer a very high friction as is the case at Paul Ricard. If you go too far outside, the car is almost stopped and the tires damaged. This is dissuasive, not dangerous and kind of penalty in itself. As you, I think it can be done with plates safely bolted. I don't think the grass is a viable solution and gravel traps must be far from the track limits. IMO.
Gerard C is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 11:47 (Ref:4166944)   #62
broadrun96
Veteran
 
broadrun96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
United States
Posts: 11,215
broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!
And keep in mind, when it is damp magically they all stay away from the painted lines they used in the dry, amazing that. Maybe just drive the damn track and pay the penalty when you don't and double penalty when you cry on the radio about the driver in front of you constantly. And then the media director for F1 gets fired out the window for deciding that's what radio is needed
broadrun96 is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 14:08 (Ref:4166964)   #63
bathurst77
Veteran
 
bathurst77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Australia
Biding my time in Vandemonia
Posts: 1,195
bathurst77 has a real shot at the podium!bathurst77 has a real shot at the podium!bathurst77 has a real shot at the podium!bathurst77 has a real shot at the podium!bathurst77 has a real shot at the podium!
I think there is a white line all around the track, if you are completely outside it you are out, like every sport.

If there are a few problematic corners such as in Austria 9 10, then the circuit should be told to change the corner shape, add a metre of tar or something. But f1 isnt supposed to be easy. IF some drivers can stay in the lines and d fast laps while others cant, thats the ggame
bathurst77 is offline  
__________________
Bathurst 1977, best day of my childhood
Worst thing ever to happen to Ford Aust Motorsport.
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 15:16 (Ref:4166970)   #64
Sodemo
Veteran
 
Sodemo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
United Kingdom
Solihull, West Mids, UK
Posts: 11,147
Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!Sodemo has a real shot at the podium!
A physical deterrent will always be the best solution in my eyes. It acts as both a deterrent and punishment all in one. It’s funny how we talk about classic tracks being covered in tarmac, yet some of the newer street circuits don’t have any run off at all. It’s almost as if there is a double standard at play in what is acceptable and required from a circuit.
Sodemo is offline  
Quote
Old 6 Jul 2023, 15:24 (Ref:4166973)   #65
Gerard C
Veteran
 
Gerard C's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
France
My place
Posts: 9,979
Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!Gerard C has a real shot at the championship!
Quote:
Originally Posted by broadrun96 View Post
And keep in mind, when it is damp magically they all stay away from the painted lines they used in the dry, amazing that. Maybe just drive the damn track and pay the penalty when you don't and double penalty when you cry on the radio about the driver in front of you constantly. And then the media director for F1 gets fired out the window for deciding that's what radio is needed
Fantastic. This one made my day! Merci beaucoup. By the way, fully agreed…
Gerard C is offline  
Quote
Old 11 Jul 2023, 17:47 (Ref:4167962)   #66
v8supes
Racer
 
Join Date: Mar 2023
Posts: 465
v8supes should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Just wanted to share this video with you all of the 2003 Austrian GP qualifying session. Track limits? What track limits..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnwJBzqvc4w

Although its way over the top, i find this much more exciting to watch than todays Formula. Thats very much a ME problem though.
v8supes is offline  
Quote
Old 12 Jul 2023, 06:37 (Ref:4168024)   #67
VIVA GT
Veteran
 
VIVA GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
England
Leicestershire
Posts: 5,647
VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!VIVA GT is going for a new world record!
Quote:
Originally Posted by v8supes View Post
Just wanted to share this video with you all of the 2003 Austrian GP qualifying session. Track limits? What track limits..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnwJBzqvc4w

Although its way over the top, i find this much more exciting to watch than todays Formula. Thats very much a ME problem though.
Awesome! Thanks for sharing, very exciting (and I think the howling V10 soundtrack added to the effect for me too!)
Plus, I'd forgotten about Ralf Firman's F1 career in the Jordan...
VIVA GT is offline  
__________________
Incognito: An Italian phrase meaning Nice Gearchange!
Quote
Old 12 Jul 2023, 08:18 (Ref:4168029)   #68
S griffin
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 18,325
S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!S griffin is going for a new world record!
And of course it was the first year we had one lap qualifying. That was fun to watch, until everyone got on top of it and the novelty went away
S griffin is offline  
__________________
He who dares wins!
He who hesitates is lost!
Quote
Old 12 Jul 2023, 13:01 (Ref:4168077)   #69
broadrun96
Veteran
 
broadrun96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
United States
Posts: 11,215
broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!broadrun96 is the undisputed Champion of the World!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerard C View Post
Fantastic. This one made my day! Merci beaucoup. By the way, fully agreed…
In fairness it was not my observation as articulate, the guys on Sky actually called drivers out for it. I just noticed no tracks limits warnings come up in the rain
broadrun96 is offline  
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
MSV and Track Limits yellowspanner Marshals Forum 25 17 Apr 2014 18:38
Time to take track limits seriously sizzle Formula One 18 11 May 2013 07:38
2013 MSA Proposed Rule Change "Track Limits" vector-pat National & International Single Seaters 75 5 Jan 2013 08:08
Respecting Track Limits The SpeCTator Touring Car Racing 8 3 Jun 2012 14:20
Regulation (14.5?) Track Limits - Silv' Int' McMuttley Racers Forum 18 6 Jun 2011 16:43


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:47.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.