Honda May Be Staying

[macdaddy]

Robert Clarke (President of HPD):

It's not my decision, that's what we're discussing internally, but my feeling is that we need to stay - regardless of the scenario.

I feel between CART and the IRL we've made a substantial investment in open wheel racing and to just walk away from that like Toyota seems kind of foolish because you lose all that investment.

I don't feel it could be considered a premium level of racing with no competition.

But it's not like there's no value, we'd still have the Indianapolis 500.

As a single make it might be difficult to meet all our objectives. But it doesn't mean it wouldn't fit HPD's business plan.

SpeedTV article.

[infoxicated]

Interesting.

I don't know why everybody is in such a rush to find out about 2007 anyways. Well, I know why the IRL haters want to know, as they're all hoping for doom and gloom. But me, as a fan, I have a season and a half of great racing to look forward to under the current spec. Time will tell the full story, and I'll be there when the first wheel turns in 2007 - no matter which manufacturer is supplying the power.

[mountainstar]

Sounds like a bunch of contradictions, so I don't think we know what Honda is going to do. I'm waiting to see what the regs are for 2007. I think we'll have a better idea of what happens next once we see that.

[GP Racer]

Originally Posted by infoxicated

Interesting.

I don't know why everybody is in such a rush to find out about 2007 anyways. Well, I know why the IRL haters want to know, as they're all hoping for doom and gloom. But me, as a fan, I have a season and a half of great racing to look forward to under the current spec. Time will tell the full story, and I'll be there when the first wheel turns in 2007 - no matter which manufacturer is supplying the power.

I'm with you infoxicated.

We're in the middle of a great season so far, and we still have another solid season after this, so I'm not exactly worrying either.

I have to believe that Honda has seen the big crowds at all the venues since Indy, and they see the growth there. That's what they would be foolish to walk away from. Ratings talk, BS walks. I also believe that Chevy will soon be reconsidering there departure for the same reason, and the fact that there car's are now very competitive...

[rush1]

Around 220,000 people at Indy, over 100,000 at Texas, 50,000 at Richmond, 80,000 in Kansas. And we are talking the actual race. No three day events and concerts included.

Indy Television ratings easily beating the NASCAR race, increased viewership in the races since Indy.

Business is improving.

[macdaddy]

Can't argue with you at all, rush1. Those are great (fantastic) numbers. And business certainly is improving.

But my advice is to not put all of your eggs into one basket. Manufacturers have proven to bolt from sucessful series' before, on a whim. All it takes is a signature from a non-racingfan in Detroit or Tokyo.

My predicton?

Honda will stay. So will Cosworth. Chevy will continue to badge them. Penske/Ilmor will add to the fray.

All will be good.

[Snrub]

What's the biggest thing to happen in OW in the last number of years? It's clearly Danica (rightly or wrongly). Her car has a Honda engine in it. I think you can see where I'm going with this. Continued press/hype give Honda a very compelling reason to stay. This year's Indy ratings are much hyped, but they were really Danica ratings, not a sudden fundimental change of heart by the public.

As for why is all this stuff/2007 important? We've seen the situation before, it could potentially kill the series! I personally find it an interesting situation.

Watching the race and seeing the monster crowd at Kansas had me thinking about this stuff. I think what really hurt CART was the negative perception that the series wasn't worth anything due to names leaving. If the manufacturers left would a similar perception swing occur? I don't know that it would. I don't think such a fall would be preceived so negatively because of the IRL's legacy of not always being as glamourous and the fact that it wouldn't be falling from the one time status as a major league sport.

[Tim Northcutt]

The way I see it, theer are:

Zytek
Judd
Nicholson-McLaren
Radical
Cosworth
Menard Competition Technologies

All currently build 3.0 - 3.4 L V-8s for sportscar racing or in Menard's case, the engines that are the Old Infinit IRL engines and they will race in sportscars by 2006

Then add as other potential suppliers:

Meachachrome
AER
JPX

Or if it goes to a production-based "kit," add builders such as:

Comptec
Yates/Roush
Jasper Engines
Speedway Engines
Ed Pink
Brayton Engines
Grant King
Illmor

Those are just off the top of my head as high-quality builders who could give teams good, solid, reliable power from whatever package the IRL would come up with for 2007....

No matter what shakes out, the IRL will have race engines....

and the Series won't miss a beat...whether manufacturers are in the show or not....

[rush1]

Originally Posted by macdaddy

Can't argue with you at all, rush1. Those are great (fantastic) numbers. And business certainly is improving.

But my advice is to not put all of your eggs into one basket. Manufacturers have proven to bolt from sucessful series' before, on a whim. All it takes is a signature from a non-racingfan in Detroit or Tokyo.

My predicton?

Honda will stay. So will Cosworth. Chevy will continue to badge them. Penske/Ilmor will add to the fray.

All will be good.

I agree with you as well MD. Only one car manufacturer is not good for any series.

Having car manufacturers in a racing series is nice because they subsidize what is an expensive sport. The series obtains free exposure from their marketing, and the companies help the teams with direct cash payments. An example might be a good portion of Dario's salary being paid by Honda.

But in many ways it seems a double edged sword because with that money comes demands for more influence. Just look at F1 and the potential split coming in 2008.

And that might present an opportunity for the IRL. Tony George should look to adding races in Europe and South America, even if demand for such races might be poor at the moment. Someone should look to capitalize on the potential civil war heading for F1.

Because NASCAR and F1 were the only winners in the North American open wheel civil war. It would be fair game for the IRL to gain from F1's stupidity.

Just thinking out loud

[GP Racer]

Originally Posted by Snrub

I think what really hurt CART was the negative perception that the series wasn't worth anything due to names leaving. If the manufacturers left would a similar perception swing occur? I don't know that it would. I don't think such a fall would be preceived so negatively because of the IRL's legacy of not always being as glamourous and the fact that it wouldn't be falling from the one time status as a major league sport.

I think most IRL fans tune into see the racing that this series produces rather than which manufacturers are involved. Series like F1, and ALMS, are more technically oriented series, where many of the fans are tech-heads, and they sometimes care more about specs, the cars, and engines more than the racing itself. The action and pace of an IRL race is normally so fast and furious that there often isn't time to dwell on, or talk to much about those things. It's more about sitting back, picking a favorite driver, and watching the action.

I agree Snrub, that if the manufacturers left tommorrow, I don't think it would be a major blow to the series. I actually think that many IRL fans would welcome a return to this series roots, and Tony's original vision. Tim mentioned how many engine builders there are out there, and I'm quite sure they would love to get in to the IRL.

[Snrub]

There's no question that purpulsion could be supplied by many, many different people, but the manufacturers and thier money have a much larger impact than that. I don't think it would have been that big of a deal to CART if the manufacturers left, but the teams/drivers stayed.

I think it's definately true that IRL fans don't care as much about technology as say F1 or ALMS fans, but I don't think major changes would go completely unnoticed.

In one of my comparisons, I was intending to mean if the manufacturers left and AGR, Penske, Ganassi and Rahal suddenly left the IRL with their drivers, would it matter much to the series? I think the series could withstand it. After all, recall that CART marketed itself as the real US OW series because it had the names. When CART lost the names, the series looked like it was dead and consequently sponsors went away. It's taken a long time for them to slowly trickle back into CC.

[rush1]

This article estimates the crowd at Kansas as being 60,000. It also mentions that touchy subject, unification.

A street race in Quebec City?

I would like to hear the opinions of some Canadians around here on that potential race.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl...TS01/507040357

[Tim Northcutt]

Two friends of mine went to Kansas City for the race....and they were there with a friend who attends races there rather often

They said that the crowd waited until about 30 minutes before the race to go to their seats because it was very hot there....

They were sitting in the First Turn and could see virtually all of the grandstands....any empty seats of note seemed to be closer to the 4th turn...their area was packed in Turn 1

They thought that the 60,000 estimate by Curt was a little low...

They asked their friend what he thought the crowd size was, and he told them about 70,000 or maybe just a little over that....and that it was a larger crowd than last year's race....which had about 60,000 in attendance.....

Not a sell-out at 80,000, but a big crowd...

FWIW

[paul-collins]

I can't imagine where in Quebec they'd do it. Simply from an infrastructure perspective.

[Tim Northcutt]

Originally Posted by paul-collins

I can't imagine where in Quebec they'd do it. Simply from an infrastructure perspective.

That's what I've heard from people who have visited there, Paul....

They just don't know where they could hold the event on streets that could handle it....or areas that could provide paddock space....etc...

Question...are there any large parks there???

[Snrub]

I've never been to Quebec city, but I imagine they could hold a reasonably successful race. We heard rumours about the IRL looking into this in the past, but nothing seemed to come out of it. The Indystar article makes it sound like it's a done deal. Wouldn't we have heard an annoucement or things about how it was going to happen instead of a half hearted mention?

I think most cities have places where a course could be setup. While I'd prefer it if the IRL wasn't so obviously gunning for CC territory, if the IRL wants to come to London Ontario, I've got an awsome course for them.

From what I could tell on TV, Kansas didn't look 100% full, but there were a heck of a lot of people there.

[Tim Northcutt]

They generally don't release the next season schedule until mid August.....

and like last year, they may actually say "We'll annnounce one more event sometime in the near future..."

That "one more event" was St. Pete....If Quebec City isn't done by mid-August, they will probably do it the same way this year....

[paul-collins]

Man I'd love to see them tear down the Grande Allee and around in the Plains of Abraham (Champs-de-Battaille).