"The Gift" - From Champweb.net

[jjspierx]

http://www.paddocktalk.com/news/html...rder=0&thold=0

Excellent read...

[Phoenix1]

Sums it up perfectly I think. Looking back to even a week ago it was still a touch and go on 18 cars and yet Cometh the hour, cometh the man (cars). Further more we had rather good coverage free on the internet. Yes no commentary but hopefully it will come and lets remember that it worked first time out! All in all Champcar is up and running and from rumours will slowly build up again without any outside influence. The ship is steady and the crew are willing

[Liz]

http://www.rfmsports.com/Editorials/...ialsindex.html

That's my version of the same thing.

Now the work is up to us. We can do it and we will!

[Brian W Keske]

We may not know the details of bank accounts and quarterly reports, but the fact reamins that these owners have shelled out allot of bucks to get eighteen cars on the grid, and have this season get under way.

You cannot keep running a viable series this way year after year.

So....it may look nice and 'shiney' right now but there remains some rust beneath the surface which will be hard to eventually fight off. It's still very much an uphill battle, and the first step to progress is getting back on network TV for some of these races, and/or in general, establishing better ROI for potential sponsors.

These guy's will not float this thing for more than two years IMO, and I really don't see how they have improved their 'postition' with the package this year.

[Cowboy]

Thanks for that jjspierx, that was a good article by Mike Sulka. It is good to read an article which is 100% positive. I personally was getting rather tired of all of the negative press which has been thrown around lately.

[macdaddy]

Brian, you keep reminding us of things we already know.
There's a race tomorrow. That's what's important today.

[Cowboy]

Nicely put macdaddy.

[Liz]

No more Doom and Gloom! We are going RACING!!!!!!!!!

Brian, did you ever consider becoming an undertaker? You do have the temperment for it.

[3state]

Fair point Liz and Macdaddy, but Brian is right. When the rust eventually eats through, and it will unless the series becomes financially viable this year please don't sit scratching your heads wondering what happened...

For me, one eye is on tomorrow's race and I hope it'll be an awesome spectacle, but another eye is firmly focused on the problem OWRS has inherited. Problems which MUST be resolved if there is to be a Long Beach next year.

[Liz]

Do you know that people who concentrate on the wrong of the world which they perceive other people are doing, and not on the good they themselves could do, don't live as long as people who enjoy the moment?

Why not concentrate on helping OWRS build the series up and not preaching despair and continually pointing out everything you could do better if only they would ask your advice? (I can imagine you talking to Alex Zanardi and answering every one of his remarks with, "Yeah, well that's wonderful, but I must point out that you have no legs!")

[3state]

I'm not 'preaching' anything as you put it, which only goes to show that you're grossly misunderstood my position and the Brian's comments. You imply that by pointing out the huge impending thunderstorm which looms on the horizon, and which you wish to ignore (and which is oyur right), that we are in fact 'preaching' the demise of Champcar and ergo, the ascendency of IRL. Nothing could be further from the truth. I take great exception with your implication that I'm anti-Champcar simply because I point to that thunderstorm looming...I enjoy Champcar. I have no time for Indycar and I want it to survive.

It is your right to ignore the thunderstorm as it is my right to discuss it here. A forum should supposedly involve the healthy discussion and exhange of views, not merely be a place for like-minded fanatics who denounce those who don't always agree.

Incidentally, you don't know me, so please don't presume to do so. I'm a realist, who concentrates on what is good and what is not good in this world in equal portions...I see the thunderstorm and worry about it's inevitable arrive and yet i expect to enjoy the race at Long Beach. i can do both equally.

[Liz]

Thunderstorms don't "inevitably arrive." In fact, they have been predicting one for our area all weekend and we have not had one. Frequently they predict blizzards, ice storms, and other dangerous weather that does not occur. In fact, people who persist in predicting bad weather and being wrong are eventually ignored.

I said nothing about the IRL and I didn't say you are "Anti CART". I said you are bloody depressing in thta you are spoiling a happy birthday party by predicting that the birthday boy is dying.

I don't dispute your right to keep on pointing out that Alex Zanardi has no legs; I do wonder why you feel compelled to keep on bringing it up.

[3state]

Liz i took issue with the way you and macdaddy jumped on Brian for rasing an important and pertinent issue.

Sure the thunderstorm may not arrive, an di hope it doesn't, but only if there is a significant change in the wind, that being, that Champcar becomes financially viable and that teams move to a position of being self-funded. If that wind-change doesn't come then the strom will be upon Champcar sooner than we think. I think Brian was saying (feel free to correct me Brian if I'm wrong) is that there is no indication that the wind is changing. You say that the storm may well not arrive. True but the storm has arrived once already leaving a devastated CART in its wake. OWRS cannot repeat those same mistakes. There won't be another buyout. This is it...

I'm not 'preaching' doom but i am being realistic.
Having said all that I'm looking forward to the racing. the grid looks good (better than last year's in fact) and the 3 amigos have clearly done amazing things to get everything together in such a short space of time and despite the odds. Let's hope they're also cogniscent of that thunderstorm and behind the scenes are doing something about it.

[Brian W Keske]

I'm involved with two businesses. One in which I'm a partner of a small corporation, the other as as a top management postion employee.

If you don't look at the realistic situation which you are in, (or could be in), you will eventually get swallowed up fast; either by the competition, or spending yourselve into oblivion by trying to keep your head above water...which only weakens you to the possibility of drowning.

I'm interested in what Champ Car can do with what they have, but by not looking at the situation realistically and simply saying everything is alright, and 'we' are proving out strength because we have eighteen cars on the grid is a falacy. The only reason there is a race today is the ability to spend some of the owners 'war chest'. Pook did the same, and put CART out of business.

I just take exception at not looking at the good and the bad at the same time. I can rip apart F1, the IRL, ALMS, etc. for something or other too. But the truth is in the actual health, not the percieved health, of a series and why it exists *over the long haul*. Eventually they have to start making money, or have the ability to be forever subsidized. I don't think these three owners will do that, nor have the ability to do that.

Again, it will be interesting to watch how these three can salvage this series, but lets not kid ourselves into thinking everything is right in the world because there is Champ Car race today, as it was, for the most part, funded by the owners own pockets.

I object to these kinds of statements in the article:

"We don’t have to worry anymore. The angst is gone. Hopefully forever.

All of the losses, all of the concern, all of the grief… is gone."

It's simply an exageration of the current situation....a polyana view IMO.

[3state]

And incidentally, I don't discuss Alex Zanardi's tragic loss of his legs because quite simply the future of Champcar isn't contingent on that self-evident truth. The future of Champcar IS however, most definitely contingent on the self-evident truth that OWRS is repeating the mistakes of CART. So Liz, your the analogy doesn't hold water.

[Cowboy]

Brian and 3state ; Here is a thought, it is the first race of the year, not the last so give up the "realism" of what may or may not happen. The bottom line of it is that you can't do a damn thing about it so quit worryin about it and enjoy the damn race. As fans, we are on the sidelines without a true veiw of the inner workings of the OWRS group, therefore quit trying to fix something that you don't have a clue if it is even broken. Yes, we all have read about the future possibilites of Champ Car and have our own worries. The funny thing about the "Future" is that you have to get through the "Present" to get there. So enjoy this race, support the series, tell all of your freinds to do the same and worry about the problems when the come

[Liz]

Ditto.

It's not your business, Brian -- meaning you neither own it, work for it nor control it. Neither does anyone on this forum. We are not privy to their books, their bank accounts, their medical records or their projections for the future.

ALL WE ARE HERE TO DO IS ENJOY THE RACING! Can't you just forget about continually providing us with your obsession with other peoples' money long enough to let us ENJOY THE RACING? I don't care if they go bankrupt on the Podium. I AM HERE TO ENJOY THE RACING! I don't go to a wedding and continually announce, "Jack is a drunk and Martha is fat, and if they don't get their act together TODAY, they won't live to have a first anniversary!" I don't go to Grandma's birthday party and insist on continually shouting, "Grandman is dying! Grandma can't live to celebrate another birthday! Can't you understand that! I'm calling attention to Grandma's impending death! Why won't you face that?"

WE'RE HERE FOR THE PARTY! WHY CAN'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT?

I'm sorry to shout But I can't understand why you persist in trying to pour cold water all over a celebration.

[norman-normal]

Here now!!! CHAMP CAR fans, hold the happyness down. Can't you see how disgusting and painfull your frivolity is to our sober and visionary contributors?

Anyone would think you are sadistic the way you try to inflict pain upon them.

[Brian W Keske]

Sure, you're right...enjoy....but again, this is was this that made me write origionally:


>>"We don’t have to worry anymore. The angst is gone. Hopefully forever.

All of the losses, all of the concern, all of the grief… is gone."<<

Other than that, as you may have noticed, I have been fairly quiet of late. I'm just as (or more so) concerned about the health of the ALMS right now. If it (either) ain't healthy I may be stuck with the reality of watching Grand-Am or the IRL, neither of which I am interested.

It would be nice to know there is a professional series that I will enjoy years into the future. Racing isn't a PARTY to me, it's a passion. And furthermore, I am just an analytical type of thinker...sorry....it takes all kinds I guess.

[norman-normal]

Brian, we are very impressed with your busness knowlege and we now know how important you are. So I, for one, do here-by note, your dire predictions and warnings to those of us, less astute; so that you may direct your attention to more important matters.

Hey Brian, just toss us in the deep end and let us sink or swim. We do deserve you.

[Brian W Keske]

Somehow, I think if I were a Champ Car lemming, I would actually be more important to you.

But really, I could care less about being important in your eyes.

But then, this is personal, and I wasn't being personal, just commenting on the article/subject. Perhaps you should try the same.

[norman-normal]

Did I get the wrong impression from your posts?

[Brian W Keske]

I have no idea what you are responding/refering to, as you chose not to discuss the subject or issue.

Again, I'll discuss the subject all you want, but you have not talked about it once, just my charachter. I simply find it offensive.

There is something called Private Message here, you can use it.

[jjspierx]

Sorry guys this topic is now closed. We are not even close to being on topic, and it doesn't look like this thread will be steering back in that direction anytime soon. I'll leave the thread up so people can still enjoy the article, and hopefully get bored and not read through all of the trash underneath it.