WRC Rally NZ

[Goat Boy]

Originally Posted by GT 86

They insisted Bill cause it was going to put more money in the till but they blew it all. As well as that they blew most of the commercial relationships that come with that money, especially Subaru and Mitsubishi. They could not deal with TMC especially Geoff Shorts way of doing things. The money wasn't there to promote the series, it was there to run future WRC events. Where do you think the TMC motorhome, the little lorry, the astronomically expensive trailer come drive over start/finish ramp come from?

If what you say is true then those involved should be forced to pay back all the money and then banned from ever being involved in motorsport ever again and banned from every circuit and event in the country.

And then they should have to get married to Colin Craig.

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by GT 86

They insisted Bill cause it was going to put more money in the till but they blew it all. As well as that they blew most of the commercial relationships that come with that money, especially Subaru and Mitsubishi. They could not deal with TMC especially Geoff Shorts way of doing things. The money wasn't there to promote the series, it was there to run future WRC events. Where do you think the TMC motorhome, the little lorry, the astronomically expensive trailer come drive over start/finish ramp come from?

Like him or not Geoff Short was a very successful sales rep for the company.
TMC has never had any involvement in WRC apart from looking after NZRC Champ side of it. No money was forwarded to the company that was to be held for future WRC events.
The Motor Home (bus converted to office??), the little Lorry were both purchased well prior to NZRC involvement, the start ramp was paid for out of TMC funds.
I think you need to do some research into TMC balance sheets and asset registers before you make some of your statements.
Front up with some evidence to back your anonamous statements.

I suppose it is easy to blame TMC for the possible failure of NZWRC as it has copped it for everything else that has ever gone wrong in motorsport.

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by flyingduck

So Bill when MSNZ decided to get TMC involved was there cash that came with it to promote the series that was high 6 figures?

There was some funds involved not sure what the amount was.

[Southern Man]

This thread started about concerns for the future of the NZ round of the WRC but here we go again with some people as well as being short on their facts, are unable to leave the past behind them. It sure must be hard to stand upright with a large section of the Kaingaroa Forest perched on one shoulder.

[The Realist]

Originally Posted by Southern Man

This thread started about concerns for the future of the NZ round of the WRC but here we go again with some people as well as being short on their facts, are unable to leave the past behind them. It sure must be hard to stand upright with a large section of the Kaingaroa Forest perched on one shoulder.

Unsure what interpretation to give this sarcasm.

You may live in the past, but we are genuinely concerned about the future of WRC in this part of the world, namely New Zealand.
Would you like me to quote you the press releases from when Australia was initially awarded their 1st 3 year contract, 2013-2015.
We were told it was a commercially driven 3 year rotation with Australia first, then NZ 2016-2018.
Now it appears our MNZ fighting fund has evaporated, and little has happened in the past 2 years to allay our fears.
So to answer your post, no we won't go away, and yes we are well informed from both sides of the Tasman.

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by Southern Man

This thread started about concerns for the future of the NZ round of the WRC but here we go again with some people as well as being short on their facts, are unable to leave the past behind them. It sure must be hard to stand upright with a large section of the Kaingaroa Forest perched on one shoulder.

Spot on Carl

[The Realist]

Originally Posted by Bill Brown

Spot on Carl

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Man
This thread started about concerns for the future of the NZ round of the WRC but here we go again with some people as well as being short on their facts, are unable to leave the past behind them. It sure must be hard to stand upright with a large section of the Kaingaroa Forest perched on one shoulder.

Unsure what interpretation to give this sarcasm.

You may live in the past, but we are genuinely concerned about the future of WRC in this part of the world, namely New Zealand.
Would you like me to quote you the press releases from when Australia was initially awarded their 1st 3 year contract, 2013-2015.
We were told it was a commercially driven 3 year rotation with Australia first, then NZ 2016-2018.
Now it appears our MNZ fighting fund has evaporated, and little has happened in the past 2 years to allay our fears.
So to answer your post, no we won't go away, and yes we are well informed from both sides of the Tasman.

These are the current issues, not some forest in the Waikato.

[raymond]

Originally Posted by The Realist

Unsure what interpretation to give this sarcasm.

You may live in the past, but we are genuinely concerned about the future of WRC in this part of the world, namely New Zealand.
Would you like me to quote you the press releases from when Australia was initially awarded their 1st 3 year contract, 2013-2015.
We were told it was a commercially driven 3 year rotation with Australia first, then NZ 2016-2018.
Now it appears our MNZ fighting fund has evaporated, and little has happened in the past 2 years to allay our fears.
So to answer your post, no we won't go away, and yes we are well informed from both sides of the Tasman.

Ok; once again here goes.
1. The original deal was for a three year rotation. That is probably still in place. However it comes at a cost. We cannot commit unless we have the funds. Repco was involved and wanted the rotation to cover both of it's markets.
2. The "fighting fund" as you call it was built up over the years of the tobacco sponsorship. Most of it was used to fund the last 3 Rally NZ events. The last one cost in excess of $1M
3. TMC received the same amount of money from MSNZ to promote the NZRC for a 2? year period that was paid via levies to Rally NZ when they promoted it. Key point here is that TMC did NOT rape the pot of the Rally NZ fund. They did not have access to those funds as they are under the control of the Board of Rally NZ
4. All those assests that were mentioned were all in place with TMC and can from circuit racing incomes.

Please can you guys quote facts, not gossip in future.

[sollitt]

Originally Posted by The Realist

... we are genuinely concerned about the future of WRC in this part of the world, namely New Zealand.

Should you have an interest in the continuation of a WRC round in NZ, you ought be concerned. Because the likelihood of ever seeing it here again is very slim.
The reality is that the event holds little relevance to NZ and, as such, it's promoters have failed to secure local funding. Couple that with outrageously high costs (both licensing and operational) and you have an event that NZ simply cannot afford to stage.
There is no shortage of larger, wealthier, countries applying to fill the void and it's no surprise that these are the places where the manufacturers prefer to play. With a foot in the door they will be impossible to oust.
You can point the finger all you like. Fact is the 'fighting fund' was always going to run out eventually. It has.

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by raymond

Ok; once again here goes.
1. The original deal was for a three year rotation. That is probably still in place. However it comes at a cost. We cannot commit unless we have the funds. Repco was involved and wanted the rotation to cover both of it's markets.
2. The "fighting fund" as you call it was built up over the years of the tobacco sponsorship. Most of it was used to fund the last 3 Rally NZ events. The last one cost in excess of $1M
3. TMC received the same amount of money from MSNZ to promote the NZRC for a 2? year period that was paid via levies to Rally NZ when they promoted it. Key point here is that TMC did NOT rape the pot of the Rally NZ fund. They did not have access to those funds as they are under the control of the Board of Rally NZ
4. All those assests that were mentioned were all in place with TMC and can from circuit racing incomes.

Please can you guys quote facts, not gossip in future.

Thanks Crunch

[The Realist]

Originally Posted by sollitt

Should you have an interest in the continuation of a WRC round in NZ, you ought be concerned. Because the likelihood of ever seeing it here again is very slim.
The reality is that the event holds little relevance to NZ and, as such, it's promoters have failed to secure local funding. Couple that with outrageously high costs (both licensing and operational) and you have an event that NZ simply cannot afford to stage.
There is no shortage of larger, wealthier, countries applying to fill the void and it's no surprise that these are the places where the manufacturers prefer to play. With a foot in the door they will be impossible to oust.
You can point the finger all you like. Fact is the 'fighting fund' was always going to run out eventually. It has.

Bruce and Raymond.
We are simply showing genuine concern for the continuation of the event. We are not poking a stick at the previous promoters, MNZ, or individuals involved.
No MNZ representative has come out and said that we require $xxxxxx number of dollars in order to successfully bid for the 2016-2018 event.
Until this forum post, no representative has come forward and said that MNZ no longer have a budget with which to place a bid for the 3 year period.
Had honesty prevailed 2 years ago when we "gave away our WRC Entitlement", many of us may have been in a position to assist with the "budget chasing" component that is now 2 years further down the track.
From what we have recently learned, NMZ and RNZ promoters appear to all be rowing on the left hand side of the boat, and although with enthusiasm and quite busy in doing so, no forward progress is being made by the boat.

[raymond]

Originally Posted by The Realist

Bruce and Raymond.
We are simply showing genuine concern for the continuation of the event. We are not poking a stick at the previous promoters, MNZ, or individuals involved.
No MNZ representative has come out and said that we require $xxxxxx number of dollars in order to successfully bid for the 2016-2018 event.
Until this forum post, no representative has come forward and said that MNZ no longer have a budget with which to place a bid for the 3 year period.
Had honesty prevailed 2 years ago when we "gave away our WRC Entitlement", many of us may have been in a position to assist with the "budget chasing" component that is now 2 years further down the track.
From what we have recently learned, NMZ and RNZ promoters appear to all be rowing on the left hand side of the boat, and although with enthusiasm and quite busy in doing so, no forward progress is being made by the boat.

Understand that. Indeed; that was the conversation until it was hi-jacked by gossip-mongers who just use every opportunity to have-a-shot, even if no facts are involved.
Firstly; RallyNZ are the principal group that runs the Rally of NZ event. MSNZ acts in a supporting role if and when required. MSNZ has never had a budget to run the Rally of NZ event. That is all RallyNZ Ltd.
Secondly; no-one has given away the "entitlement" as you call it. Rally NZ in conjunction with advisors have been working continuously for the past years to find the funds and still are.
Thirdly; by all means offer to help budget chase. Contact Rally NZ directly. By now you should know the figures that are required.
Fourthly; not sure about the boating analogy, but the budget required is more superyacht as opposed to rowboat.
Fifthly; Rally NZ have reported each year to it's shareholders the amount of money each event has cost and what they will need for the future. This happens at the MSNZ conference. So to state that no-one has told anyone how much is required isn't quite correct.
Have a look at the Facebook page "Bring back WRC" as I have put a few details on that.

[sollitt]

I agree with Realist's last post. Something the sport has done very poorly, in my view, (and I have expressed this more than once to various MNZ Presidents and executive) is sell itself and obtain even reasonable levels of sponsorship.
Despite Bill's admiration of TMC's commissioned agent, efforts to secure funding for NZRC were woefully inadequate and, at times, were nothing more than attempts to draw existing sponsors away from individual events.

It would seem that much of the focus on funding for the WRC round has been directed at central Government. There appears an expectation that we're 'owed', that we're more deserving than yachting or rugby.
This misguided nonsense will get us nowhere.

I have always believed that with the right people and application, the result (about $2m ?) was achievable.
There was a time when I too was in a position to assist with this.

I fear the horse has now bolted.

[Goat Boy]

I don't think it's just rally that is struggling for money as can be seen in the other threads, Pity with our proud history

[smokin'joe]

Originally Posted by sollitt

I agree with Realist's last post. Something the sport has done very poorly, in my view, (and I have expressed this more than once to various MNZ Presidents and executive) is sell itself and obtain even reasonable levels of sponsorship.
Despite Bill's admiration of TMC's commissioned agent, efforts to secure funding for NZRC were woefully inadequate and, at times, were nothing more than attempts to draw existing sponsors away from individual events.

It would seem that much of the focus on funding for the WRC round has been directed at central Government. There appears an expectation that we're 'owed', that we're more deserving than yachting or rugby.
This misguided nonsense will get us nowhere.

I have always believed that with the right people and application, the result (about $2m ?) was achievable.
There was a time when I too was in a position to assist with this.

I fear the horse has now bolted.

i am sure with our Leaders view on foreign ownership, they could get sponship from a Chinese farm broker to fund the rally, and use the backdrop for advertising potential purchases ............... imagine what Johnboy could get for the Whaanga Coast on the open market !!!!!

[Bill Brown]

Originally Posted by sollitt

I agree with Realist's last post. Something the sport has done very poorly, in my view, (and I have expressed this more than once to various MNZ Presidents and executive) is sell itself and obtain even reasonable levels of sponsorship.
Despite Bill's admiration of TMC's commissioned agent, efforts to secure funding for NZRC were woefully inadequate and, at times, were nothing more than attempts to draw existing sponsors away from individual events.

It would seem that much of the focus on funding for the WRC round has been directed at central Government. There appears an expectation that we're 'owed', that we're more deserving than yachting or rugby.
This misguided nonsense will get us nowhere.

I have always believed that with the right people and application, the result (about $2m ?) was achievable.
There was a time when I too was in a position to assist with this.

I fear the horse has now bolted.

Bruce, admiration is going a bit over the top.
He was actually contracted to sell our Summer Series and he did that very successfully, while there as a product to sell.