[Rules] Future Rule Changes

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

So what happens when on the "in lap" an eliminated car breaks down and the yellows come out?

This may well cause what BCE wants; a mixed up grid. My own opinion, this new system is a stupid as the new tyre rules which I fail to understand. Gawd help a casual viewer watching a race trying to comprehend all the unnecessary complications.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

So what happens when on the "in lap" an eliminated car breaks down and the yellows come out?

Same thing as now, it may ruin other's laps. Also it is unlikely.

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

This may well cause what BCE wants; a mixed up grid. My own opinion, this new system is a stupid as the new tyre rules which I fail to understand. Gawd help a casual viewer watching a race trying to comprehend all the unnecessary complications.

I don't think it is that hard to follow. If your slowest you're out. If your fastest in Q3 you're on pole

I wouldn't have this format, but I'm not going to hate it for the wrong reasons.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

I share the same interpretation as Niki Lauda; in each qualifying session, you only need to set the fastest time just once, and then you are reliant on whatever tyres you have available. Based on times set during testing, this may well give Mercedes a fairly hefty advantage as they seemed to be able to achieve lap times equal to other cars, but on a harder compound.

I think that we may well see Mercedes, and possibly Ferrari, come out and post their quick laps and then go and disappear in their garages.

yep, i am assuming that Lauda knows what he is talking about and his fears would then be well founded but i guess what confuses me is that if he is right then why were some saying this would be a complicated system or that a new timing system needed to be created.

every 90 seconds just eliminate the person with the slowest session time....seems rather straightforward.

[Adam43]

You still need tweaks (only) to the timing to administer the cut offs and display the driver who is out. Maybe also to countdown to the next cut off and perhaps even play the countdown music, da da, da da, derder derum.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Adam43

You still need tweaks (only) to the timing to administer the cut offs and display the driver who is out. Maybe also to countdown to the next cut off and perhaps even play the countdown music, da da, da da, derder derum.

Yes, but it's not bloomin' Countdown; this is supposed to be a contest between racers competing against others in multi-million state-of-the-art machines! And my comprehension comments are more directed to the new tyre rules.

And, chillibowl, it would seems as though the teams only accepted this new system as the quid pro quo for not having reverse grids made compulsory by BCE.

[chillibowl]

whatever the reasons, at this point i would be happy for some music to accompany the show but only if i can vote on Twitter for it first.

also LH is pretty popular on Instagram. maybe the other drivers should have dogs too?

[Peter Mallett]

Anyone remember the cartoon duck that used to appear on TV cricket coverage to signify a "duck"? Perhaps something similar to signify the slowest driver?

That would be great.

[Alfaholic]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Anyone remember the cartoon duck that used to appear on TV cricket coverage to signify a "duck"? Perhaps something similar to signify the slowest driver?

That would be great.

[djinvicta]

They could have a cartoon BE running across the screen....

[Mike Harte]

The new rules regarding communications with the drivers has just been released, and I have copied them from Motorsport dot com:

Amid its push for a strict Formula 1 radio clampdown this year, the FIA has issued even more restrictions ahead of the first race of the season in Australia.

In a note sent by F1 race director Charlie Whiting to the teams before they travelled to Australia, an updated list of limitations means restrictions go much further than initially announced.
And while clarifying what items can be discussed, it is interesting to note the communications that have now been ruled out at this latest stage.
The full FIA document

A. Restrictions on team-to-driver communications
These restrictions will apply:
- To all communications to the driver including, but not limited to, radio and pit boards,
- At all times the car is out of the garage with the driver on board (with the exception of any time the car is in the pitlane on the day of the race prior to or between reconnaissance laps).
The following is a list of the permitted messages.
Any other message, including any of those below, which we suspect has been used as a coded message for a different purpose (including a prompt to a driver) is likely to be considered a breach of Article 20.1 of the Sporting Regulations and will be reported to the stewards accordingly.
1. Acknowledgement that a driver's message has been heard.
2. Indication of a critical problem with the car, any message of this sort may only be used if failure of a component or system is imminent and potential terminal.
3. Information concerning damage to the car.
4. Instructions to select driver defaults for the sole purpose of mitigating loss of function of a sensor, actuator or controller whose degradation or failure was not detected and handled by the on-board software. In according with Article 8.2.4, any new setting chosen in this way must not enhance the performance of the car beyond that prior to the loss of function.
5. Instruction to enter the pit lane in order to fix or retire the car.
6. Indication of a problem with a competitor's car.
7. Marshalling information (red flag, blue flag, yellow flag, safety car, virtual safety car, race start aborted or other similar instructions or information from race control).
8. Passing on message from race control (this would exclude a countdown to the start of the formation lap and telling a driver that the last car has taken up position on the grid at the end of the formation lap).
9. Wet track, oil or debris in certain corners.
10. Weather information.
11. Information concerning the driver's own laptime or sector times.
12. Laptime detail of a competitor.
13. Helping with warning of traffic and gaps to other competitors during a practice session or race.
14. Instructions to swap positions with other drivers.
15. Number of laps or time remaining during a practice session or a race.
16. Position during a practice session or a race.
17. 'Push hard', 'Push now', 'You will be racing xx', 'take it easy' or similar (you are reminded about suspected use of coded messages when giving these messages or any words of encouragement).
18. When to enter the pits (or go to the grid during reconnaissance laps), any message of this sort may only be used if a driver is to enter the pits on that lap.
19. Reminders to use the speed limiter, change tyre settings to match the tyres fitted to the car or to check for white lines, bollards, weighbridge lights when entering or leaving the pits.
20. Driving breaches by team driver or competitors, e.g. missing chicanes, running off track, time penalty will be applied etc.
21. Notification that DRS is enabled or disabled.
22. Dealing with a DRS system failure.
23. Oil transfer.
24. Test sequence information during practice sessions, e.g. aero-mapping.
What's been removed

As well as detailing what is allowed, the latest document is fascinating for getting an understanding of some items that were previously considered okay but are no longer allowed.

The items removed are:

• Gaps to a competitor during a practice session or race
• Giving the gaps between cars in qualifying so as to better position the car for a clear lap
• Tyre choice at the next pit stop
• Number of laps a competitor has done on a set of tyres during the race
• Tyre specification of a competitor
• Information concerning a competitor's likely race strategy
• Safety Car window
• Change of front wing position at the next pit stop
• Reminders about track limits
• Number of laps remaining

There are a few things in the lists that surprise me, and are puzzling. Firstly, a team is allowed to notify it's drivers of a competitor's lap time, but not it's own drivers' times; that really makes no sense to me! Then we have the rule that a team is no longer able to advise their driver of how many laps are remaining.

This is just going from the sublime to the ridiculous. Times and laps have been provided to drivers since as far back as I can remember, and 50 odd years ago my pit crew would write that info in chalk on a black pit board to help me. And does it really do any harm to tell your driver what the gap is between you and another competitor. Surely that is not tutoring a driver, and nor would it be taking the driving decisions away from the driver, because, in what seems to be a contradiction to me, the team is allowed to tell the driver to speed up, slow down or cruise.

It appears to me that every time that either the FIA or FOM seeks to change the rules they don't think about the possible consequences.

[chillibowl]

thanks Mike.

its a confusing list for sure but it looks like the team can tell its driver their lap and sector times. if the driver can be told their own lap time and their competitor's laptime then they can work out the difference in their own heads. if i am reading that right then im ok with this.

The following is a list of the permitted messages....


11. Information concerning the driver's own laptime or sector times.
12. Laptime detail of a competitor.

[Mike Harte]

I must have had a bad half hour, because as you say, chillibowl, they are allowed to give the drivers their own times; I really don't know what went wrong there; put it down to computer error rather than brain fart.

Having re-read the list again, the website has either made a typo or the FIA has cocked up. Amongst the permitted transmissions is #13 which allows info on gaps to traffic and competitors, yet in the items removed, which I assume to mean that they are no longer permitted, are those two permitted transmissions. Then we have #15 which permits the teams to advise on number of laps left or time remaining, yet in the banned list is the exact opposite.

[chillibowl]

i had to re read it a few times too.

finding new ways to confuse people is apparently the only rule change that all the parties could agree to for the upcoming season!

[Adam43]

I like that it rewards drivers who can do basic maths.

[Richard C]

Given the mixed conditions so far in Australia, I am waiting for that scenario in which it is lightly raining at the start of qualifying and there is an insane dash to get quick times in because just maybe your first flying lap of ALL qualifying sessions might be your best. Can we imagine on track accidents between cars (not solo accidents due to pushing too hard) during qualifying?

Richard

[Adam43]

Although that has potentially always been the case, but we've never had any real problems. In sessions where it was likely for conditions to get worse all the drivers they have queued to get out of the pit lane and gone for it. Previously those early minutes of a qualifying session have been called exciting.

It was the case last year and when we only had one hour session for Q. Of course with the last few years, and this year, we might get that three times.

[Another Bob]

OK, just finished watching qualifying.

Future rule change should be discard the new qualifying rules.

[wolfhound]

Bernie has called the new qualifying rules 'crap'.
Now who's idea were the new rules anyway???????

http://www.autosport.com/news/report...ualifying-crap

[Moneyseeker]

Originally Posted by wolfhound

Bernie has called the new qualifying rules 'crap'.
Now who's idea were the new rules anyway???????

http://www.autosport.com/news/report...ualifying-crap

Bernie seems to want some sort of false mixed up grid, thinking it will spice up the races. In which case we may as well go for sprinkling tin tacs on the track when the fastest cars are on track, or perhaps go for the famous Clive James quote that the 'grid was decided by colour of hair.....'

We just need Ferrari and or anyone else to get there act together and challenge Mercedes on pace.

[Mike Harte]

I don't seem to remember BCE whinging and whining when Williams and McLaren had there time when they were dominant, nor when Ferrari or Red Bull were sweeping all before them. Yet now that Mercedes has managed to put the best package together coupled with a pair of fast drivers, he thinks that he needs to interfere with the natural order of qualifying for the races, and that the starting grid should be determined by artificial means.

This is just one of the many reasons that I no longer waste my precious few hours on this planet watching F1.

[wolfhound]

Bernie said he was not enthusiastic about the new qually format from the start, I thought that he was the one pushing to change the format of qualifying. If so he is primarily responsible for its introduction. I wonder if he is man enough to admit his mistake. Admitting mistakes is something Bernie is not fond of doing.

I think for an elimination style qually it would need to be a much longer session so that everybody has time to absorb what is happening. Something like 5 minute intervals might work but you would still need a proper shoot out of the front runners.

[Another Bob]

Totally agree Wolfhound,

Q1 & Q2 same type of elimination type format, but give them more time so they realise they are on the bottom and can get organised so they can run there adrenaline fueled flying desperation lap (make or break) to try and get off the bottom of the list. That in itself if run properly could make some interesting viewing.

Q3, I think go back to the final 8 or 10 running for the full total session time to determine order.

Either that or just dump it and go back to the previous qualy format.

That's my "arm chair expert" opinion.

[chillibowl]

im going to reserve judgement to see if some of those knocked out early or chose to save their tires can do something a little different during the race.

its a long shot maybe but Force India looked to have pace throughout so they may have found the trick by settling for P9 and P10.

the teams seemed to struggle with the timing which will improve the more they try this but yeah 4 minutes of nothing at the end is a major problem.

[Akrapovic]

So a count down system that elimates cars as it goes, but the session is still split into 3 parts. So that's clearly for TV advert breaks then. I bet NASCAR is upset they haven't come up with a system this ridiculous first.

Combine this with the tyre rules and this is just an over complex mess to work around the problems that F1 has.

[Richard C]

I guess there is a slim chance things might improve in future races, but at the moment the new qualifying rules appear to be a complete failure. BE said the goal was to shake up the order and it has a bit, but not really enough to achieve their goals of making the race more interesting.

It compressed each session into just a few laps. Few is any cars on track at the end. Other than teams and drivers being frustrated, the big losers is the fans. Imagine being at the track to watch qualifying! They messed with the one thing that generally worked and broke it.

I expect it might play out slightly differently at the next race. It is less about drivers getting out and cranking out the laps, but your strategist (really software that factors in stuff like in and out lap times, time to put on another set of tire, 90 second driver drop countdown, flying lap times, etc.) to determine when the perfect time to leave pit will be. Then depending upon those values above, you will get x number of laps and no more (maybe less depending upon mistakes made). So they may get a bit of a better handle on it, but in general it will still be a compressed session with driver potentially on faster flying laps not being able to move forward. And short of major screw ups, I don't see significant changes to the qualifying order.

What are the odds this will be dumped within a handful of races? Wasn't a supposed driver for change being promoters complaining about the "show"? Now that qualifying has been ruined for the fans, will promotors push for a quick undo?

Richard