|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
5 Jul 2005, 20:56 (Ref:1348220) | #26 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 6,958
|
I've got to come back and restate the Mercedes CLK as a car over the Toyota GT ONE's.
Mercedes spent the time and money to compete for full seasons, to perfect their cars, entertain us, and were utterly dominant in FIA GT. The Toyota's showed up only at LeMans, and frankly didn't deserve to win for this reason alone. As we've seen since, it pays to race the cars and iron out the wrinkles... something Toyota did not do. Wonderful cars, incredible looking, but they lost for the lack of competing. The Mercedes lost on dumb luck mostly. In 98' starting from pole, (and third) and having power steering issues in both cars. Quote:
Anyway, after competing in the FIA GT for several years, plenty of testing and dollars, Mercedes IMHO deserved to win much more than did the Toyota cherry pickers, who wouldn't show their face in other races or series. |
|||
|
5 Jul 2005, 21:02 (Ref:1348226) | #27 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,699
|
I would agree with that Fogelhund. I find the Toyota GT-One effort very disappointing. The cars actually raced less than the Bentley, which is the subject of many negative comments in the other worst thread. I do find it ironic that so many pay homage to the Toyota effort, but many are now slagging Bentley's marketing display.
|
||
__________________
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." Albert Einstein |
5 Jul 2005, 21:20 (Ref:1348246) | #28 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,555
|
I think it's probably because the Toyota looked simply awesome - the Merc probably did at first, but then again it had been seen many many times when Le Mans came around - although Merc put the time and effort in, although partly the end result was the death of the old GT1 class...
|
||
|
5 Jul 2005, 21:51 (Ref:1348278) | #29 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,831
|
Porsche 917 Longtail. Purpose built for Le Mans but never came home with the win.
|
|
|
6 Jul 2005, 01:19 (Ref:1348379) | #30 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 550
|
Ferrari 333sp
Toyotas TS010 and TS020 |
||
|
6 Jul 2005, 07:20 (Ref:1348517) | #31 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 4,349
|
The 333sp is a good choice. It had bags of potential but was never developed by the factory and therefore was way too fragile and was more aimed at Daytona than LeMans I beleive.
The Merc CLK is a good choice too, everyone that year was sure it was going to steamroller the event. I remember the mercedes crew being stunned when they were both out before dusk. The GT1 toyota is a definate candidate - remember it got to within sight of victory when a tyre failure put him out |
||
|
6 Jul 2005, 08:59 (Ref:1348577) | #32 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,626
|
The 512 Coda Lungas.... I still watch every now and then to see if Steve fails to block # 8 in the last lap.....
|
||
|
6 Jul 2005, 09:32 (Ref:1348599) | #33 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,133
|
The 512 is a good choice, as is the GTone.
What about the Porsche 908? it won almost every other race in its long career and many guise's, but it never pulled off the big one. It came very very close once, but just missed out. Its near cousin the 936 did the job a couple of times. |
||
__________________
Some people will tell you that slow is good - and it may be, on some days - but I am here to tell you that fast is better. H S Thompson 1937 - 2005 |
6 Jul 2005, 10:20 (Ref:1348633) | #34 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 268
|
The 333Sp had 1 or 2 class wins but no overall wins... and it's a shame for such a wonderful car, if only Ferrari wasn't so bothered winning the "Karting with Bernie championship" they would have got some developement and probably won Le Mans from 95 to 98
And of course the Toyota, wonderful, fast.... unlucky car |
||
|
6 Jul 2005, 12:23 (Ref:1348712) | #35 | ||||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,814
|
Quote:
Quote:
Mercedes/Sauber seem to have produced several cars that were superb but failed to win Le Mans. The SSK, 300 SLR, Sauber C11, and CLK were all, in their own ways, brilliant sportscars that never won the big one. It's ironic that both of the Merc's LM wins came when they weren't the quickest, especially with the 300SL in 1952 (the words 'foot', 'Jaguar', 'themselves', 'shot', 'in', 'the' come to mind). |
||||
|
6 Jul 2005, 13:00 (Ref:1348736) | #36 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 5,147
|
The car that I wish had've won LM is the F312PB. Never entered, alas. But 1972 was all about Ferrari otherwise...
|
||
__________________
... Since all men live in darkness, who believes something is not a test of whether it is true or false. I have spent years trying to get people to ask simple questions: What is the evidence, and what does it mean? -Bill James |
6 Jul 2005, 13:09 (Ref:1348744) | #37 | ||
Racer
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 147
|
The Dallara built Ferrari 333SP won everything bar Le Mans! It seemed to go on forever! Lola's of modern time have also disappointed at Le Mans!
|
||
|
6 Jul 2005, 14:27 (Ref:1348809) | #38 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,761
|
either the Toyota GT-One or Mercedes CLK-GTR LM in my book, but i think that the GT-One takes it for the unbelievable circumstances behind its last loss in '99
|
|
|
8 Jul 2005, 14:51 (Ref:1350344) | #39 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,814
|
Quote:
|
|||
|
8 Jul 2005, 19:24 (Ref:1350515) | #40 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 555
|
I had forgotten about the 333SP.
My picks have all been stated. The Toyota GT1 was the first thing that came to mind. The CLR-LM was just beautiful to me. That was a shame. I was also really pulling for the Porsche GT1s in 1997 also. |
|
|
8 Jul 2005, 19:25 (Ref:1350519) | #41 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 555
|
also, also, also! That last sentence sounds really stupid.
|
|
|
9 Jul 2005, 10:08 (Ref:1350950) | #42 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,601
|
Don't worry about it......
|
||
__________________
23 days... |
9 Jul 2005, 17:23 (Ref:1351229) | #43 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 124
|
Another vote for the Sauber C11 here - looked and sounded fabulous and was the class of the field in WSPC, but it all went wrong at LM the year the Mazda won.
The Porsche GT1-96 is a candidate for me, too. Ignoring the controversy for a moment, they appeared at their first race, ran like trains for 24 hours and dominated the class - but it wasn't quite enough. The Toyota was a one-race wonder (apart from the Suzuka 1000km) and for that reason I was glad it never won (even though it looked amazing). |
||
|
18 May 2015, 00:56 (Ref:3538777) | #44 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 15
|
The MC-12...
|
||
|
18 May 2015, 04:44 (Ref:3538817) | #45 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 273
|
Jaguar XJR 14 , shame it never ran past qualifying
I always had a soft spot for the Panoz LMP1's shame Audi R8 appeared at the same time otherwise the story could have been different. |
||
__________________
"Aerodynamics are for people who cannot build proper engines" - Enzo Ferrari 1960 Vingt Quatre Heures Du Mans |
18 May 2015, 07:14 (Ref:3538835) | #46 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 6,654
|
|||
__________________
Hvil i Fred Allan. (Rest in Peace Allan) |
18 May 2015, 08:11 (Ref:3538842) | #47 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,977
|
Congratulations on resurrecting a decade old thread which gave me an opportunity to revisit what I think may have been my first post on here...
Not sure the intervening 10 years have given me cause to change my vote much from the LC2. Taking into context, Pescarolo should have won in 2005, simply because they'd built something so specifically for the rules that year and the alignment of stars that allows a privateer to beat a manufacturer comes along so infrequently. Riffing on this theme a little, the best sportscars to only win once recently are the 908 and the R15, but perhaps the main theme to emerge is revisiting the old theme of why Toyota have never won Le Mans? |
||
|
18 May 2015, 08:30 (Ref:3538845) | #48 | ||
Team Crouton
20KPINAL
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 39,601
|
|||
__________________
23 days... |
18 May 2015, 09:07 (Ref:3538854) | #49 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 8,611
|
There should be a thread of 'best sportscars never raced at Le Mans'. What a shame we never saw the likes of Vitaphone or a Maserati factory squad tussling with Prodrive and P&M. A sight to behold. We know how Vitaphone fared against AMR at the 2005 Spa 24hrs but one wonders how they would've gone against the Corvette juggernaut. The TS020 gets another vote for best car to never win with the Panoz LMP1 a close second. |
||
__________________
Somebody asked if the McLaren F1 was going to be like the Ferrari F40, Gordon Murray replied, "I don't think so, there's no one at McLaren who can weld that badly." |
18 May 2015, 09:10 (Ref:3538856) | #50 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,731
|
There are just so many that choosing 1 is almost impossible but if really pushed then from my first years the old Aston Nimrod, should have won but for an unfortunate accident that was not it's fault IMHO
|
||
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Sportscar/GT (and Le Mans) Rumours and Repetition | The Badger | Sportscar & GT Racing | 8717 | 2 Jul 2017 22:21 |
[Memorabilia] Le Mans + Sportscar Posters | Acid09 | Armchair Enthusiast | 2 | 22 Jun 2013 03:15 |
[LM24] Worst sportscar ever to win Le Mans | cybersdorf | 24 Heures du Mans | 106 | 18 Jul 2005 09:27 |
[LM24] Le Mans Series and Sportscar Racer | Speedworx | 24 Heures du Mans | 20 | 6 Feb 2002 03:55 |