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7 Mar 2012, 21:22 (Ref:3036681) | #1 | ||
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A stint?
There are a few new cars this year. Different privateers, hybrid petrols, hybrid diesels.
How many laps is everyone going to do in a stint? 10 or 11 for the diesels? What about the diesel hybrids, the petrol hybrids, or anyone else for that matter? |
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8 Mar 2012, 00:04 (Ref:3036737) | #2 | |
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Based off of last year, the Peugeot turbo diesels used around 5.4 liters of fuel per lap, partly due to the fact the body produced less drag and downforce compared to the Audis. The Audis reportedly could run just under 12 laps, so they used just a bit more fuel then Peugeot.
So, now with a 60 liter fuel tank for 2012, and at 5.4 liters a lap, the turbo diesels could run 11 laps, but it will be close. The 908 for sure could run 11 laps with this year's regulations, but I'm not so sure about the higher downforce body of the R18, unless they've made changes to it to get less drag. I'm sure Audi has done the math, and knowing how close it will be surely they've focused on fuel economy this time around, knowing it almost let Peugeot win the race last year. The diesel hybrids have 2 liters less fuel then the standard car, so any advantage from the hybrid has been almost eliminated. The gasoline Hybrid of Toyota is carrying 20% more fuel then the turbo diesels. 11 laps for Toyota should be no problem at all. So, I think all the front runners will be able to run 11 laps, but Toyota should have slightly faster pitstops as I dont think their tank will be as empty as the Audis. |
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8 Mar 2012, 06:51 (Ref:3036832) | #3 | ||
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So you reckon Toyota won't run their tank dry? I appreciate the issue over time in the pits compared with extra very light running......
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12 Mar 2012, 22:00 (Ref:3039065) | #4 | ||
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I think most of the cars will have made some effort to improve fuel consumption so perhaps 12 laps a time.
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14 Mar 2012, 04:11 (Ref:3040739) | #5 | ||
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The big wild card for me this year is the Delta Wing. How many laps will it run? With much more efficient aero, a 75 liter tank, and a small engine that produces 200+ less horsepower then a R18, how many laps could it run? It would be something else if it could do 15 or 16 laps, or hour long runs. |
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14 Mar 2012, 07:23 (Ref:3040770) | #6 | ||
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14 Mar 2012, 08:23 (Ref:3040792) | #7 | ||
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14 Mar 2012, 14:59 (Ref:3040951) | #8 | ||
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I'm sure there is a restrictor in the diesel filler system, to slow them down. I believe, it's so, in theory, a full tank takes as long for both.
As said though, some will still have not quite a laps worth of fuel onboard, so lose less time in fuelling to the top. And, yes, I expect Audi to have the wick turned down, now their biggest rival has gone. Unless Toyota spring a surprise in the Ardennes... |
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14 Mar 2012, 15:29 (Ref:3040962) | #9 | ||
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Something I wonder is might a Hybrid motor allow cars to go that extra lap when before they still/only had 8/10ths of a lap worth of fuel left?
Run it until the tank is totally empty then use the battery to bring it home. |
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14 Mar 2012, 15:58 (Ref:3040977) | #10 | ||
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That would mean no more "Frank Biela, what went wrong?" moments... but at the state of hybrid systems right now, I'd suspect that the last 2/10ths of the lap would still be done at a crawl and not at racing speed. Probably the perfect thing to do would be to run the thing dry exactly and precisely in the pitlane entry with the energy recovery system fully charged.
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14 Mar 2012, 18:29 (Ref:3041044) | #11 | ||
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I can hear someone at Audi saying 'We can do that' right now.......
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23 Mar 2012, 10:41 (Ref:3047021) | #12 | ||
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They can, BUT the rules were changed a while ago to state the car must be propelled by their PRIMARY power source. That's why cars aren't allowed any more to come back on their starter motor while the battery still held charge as used to be the case. Ask Olly Gavin who fell foul of this at our poste back in 2007 - he and my poste chief had an interesting discussion!!!!!
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23 Mar 2012, 10:43 (Ref:3047022) | #13 | |||
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23 Mar 2012, 19:16 (Ref:3047219) | #14 | |||
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The noisy one at Pit Lane entry! |
23 Mar 2012, 20:38 (Ref:3047254) | #15 | ||
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From all the discussions in the technical threads, it seems as if that only applies if the KERS powers the front wheels (i.e. to the Audis).
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3 Jun 2012, 16:26 (Ref:3084589) | #16 | ||
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Interesting to compare the stints of the leading cars: http://fiawec.alkamelsystems.com/Res...actice%201.PDF
The Audis (Ultra and Hybrid) were able to post some 12 lap stints (remember that last year they only ran 11 lap stints during the race). On the other hand, the longest stint from Toyota was a 10 lap, while Rebellion were able to achieve at least one 11 lap stint. |
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3 Jun 2012, 16:40 (Ref:3084570) | #17 | |||
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3 Jun 2012, 16:47 (Ref:3084574) | #18 | |
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Petrol cars, incl Toyota have bigger tanks and fuel flow restrictors that balance things a little even if the diesels manage to make longer stints (which I don't think will be the case despite that data). This of course was never the case between Audi and Pug
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3 Jun 2012, 17:07 (Ref:3084581) | #19 | ||
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Don't know if the Toyota actually went for a good full-tank run at any point during the sessions, the stint lengths were rather inconsistent and there was only a single 10-lap run by car 7 (at least in the morning). Audi though... at least 3 12-lap stints in the morning session across the four cars.
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3 Jun 2012, 17:09 (Ref:3084590) | #20 | |
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Check again.
In the morning the #7 Toyota did a 11 lap stint (lap 8 -> 19). See http://fiawec.alkamelsystems.com/Res...actice%201.PDF In the afternoon the #8 Toyota did a 12 lap stint (lap 4 -> 16) and a 11 lap stint (lap 16 -> 27). See http://fiawec.alkamelsystems.com/Res...actice%202.PDF In the morning the #12 Rebellion did two 12 lap stints (lap 17 -> 29 and lap 29 -> 41) and the #13 Rebellion did one 12 lap stint (lap 25 -> 37). Last edited by gwyllion; 4 Jun 2012 at 10:40. Reason: added Rebellion stint length |
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3 Jun 2012, 17:23 (Ref:3084598) | #21 | ||
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You're right gwyllion, I must return to school to learn how to count
BTW, do the petrol cars have a 75 litre tank (minus 2 litres for the hybrids)? |
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3 Jun 2012, 18:33 (Ref:3084643) | #22 | |
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Its hard to tell. There was so much gamesmanship being played. YOu get the feeling that that fuel mileage is one of the aces up there sleeves for Toyota. As well as a little more pace than we saw in the test day. People have been saying the Toyota will do 2 laps longer than the Audi. That's very believable from of experts like like Toyota.
The most important thing for a new car like their own is for it to get on track and do flawless uninterrupted stints. For the most part that's exactly what they did ignoring red and yellow flags. It was a great day for them. I think they have a lot of good data to pour over. Including exactly how much fuel was left in the tanks after each stop. Im sure they'll turn up all the dials on engine mappings, electric power etc. |
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3 Jun 2012, 18:37 (Ref:3084649) | #23 | |||
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3 Jun 2012, 19:06 (Ref:3084664) | #24 | ||
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They're here Adam - all the experts are here......
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3 Jun 2012, 19:33 (Ref:3084689) | #25 | |
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@Articus: Please provide references for your claim.
I looked at the data from the Spa and there the privateer petrol cars and Audi did similar stints. The ultra even mentioned to do one more lap on a full tank of diesel than the petrol cars. |
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