WEC New rules. New manufacturers. The 2021 and beyond positivity thread! - Page 64

**Aysedasi** · 28 Jul 2023, 07:45 (Ref:4170204)

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadrun96

I think if more Hypercar/GTPs come on they can spread the costs of second aircraft to open the field a bit more. Does anyone want 10 GTs and the rest hypercars? That might as well be single class racing

I'd happily take all prototypes.

Simmi · 28 Jul 2023, 08:03 (Ref:4170212)

Of all the certainties we know, the cyclical nature of sportscars is one of them. I'd maybe be up for all-top class for a couple of years in WEC. But certainly not at Le Mans. And certainly not for too long.

Multi-class racing gives you multiple things to concentrate on and crucially, multiple story lines if one class isn't producing the goods. Traffic management is part of the challenge and for me it is an unfortunate side effect of this awesome time that we're stripping classes away with every passing season.

S griffin · 28 Jul 2023, 10:32 (Ref:4170227)

We'll always have enough sportscars to compete. Not sure an all top class would work in the WEC, but you never know. However I agree they should continue to have multi class at LM, at least long term.

Multi class racing means people up and down the field have something to fight for and also means there's less elitism. It's part of the fun to have so many cars compete in 24 hour races and long may it continue

**Aysedasi** · 28 Jul 2023, 11:21 (Ref:4170232)

I'm a creature who cut his teeth on Group C. I loved the C1/C2 era and only really experienced GTs at Le Mans when Balestre tried to destroy sports car racing in the early 90's. I'm honest enough to admit that GT's have effectively saved the day on more than one occasion over the years since, but a whole field of prototypes would have me salivating at the prospect.

**PascaLM** · 28 Jul 2023, 12:08 (Ref:4170236)

I'd vote for three categories :
LMH, "big" GT and "small" GT, like years ago with GTO and GTU in IMSA or GT1 and GT2. The non-factory and smaller structures would be able to race. And a specific BoP in each category would make more sense.

JT240Z · 28 Jul 2023, 12:13 (Ref:4170237)

Part of the lure of sports car racing is the variety. I would don't particularly like single class racing. The more classes the more variety on the track. The differences in performance make it challenging and fun to watch. I use to love to watch the speed difference between LMP1 and GTO/GTU cars coming down the long straight into turn 10a/10b at Road Atlanta. Was truly amazing to see how the classes could avoid contact under these conditions.

DistortedSmile · 28 Jul 2023, 18:24 (Ref:4170292)

I'd take a diverse grid of GT3 cars over the Oreca class any day, especially since most of the LMP2 superteams will be on Hypercar anyway.
Also it's kind of surreal that the biggest 'problem' right now is there being so many top class cars that grid capacity is actually a concern.

Mike E · 28 Jul 2023, 20:54 (Ref:4170306)

Oh, Mazda, you tease!

https://robbreport.com/motors/cars/m...ercar-2913315/

Gerard C · 28 Jul 2023, 21:48 (Ref:4170318)

Looks good thanks to the no wing effect. As to compare it to the '95 winning GTR…

flatlandsman · 29 Jul 2023, 06:54 (Ref:4170347)

I think LMP2 is superb, it is stable, the cars are quick and a little within their limits so slowed have they been, so they can be pushed very hard. The differences are minute and largely down the team work and strategy, as it should be.

Hypercar is great yes, but you can NOT and should NEVER EVER move away from having multi class. It is the gift that keeps on giving, whenever it is there.

I can give you numerous examples of this making WEC or any top line endurance racing the pinnacle of motorsport, no matter what any Netflix F1 aficionado says. Those first two hours at Le Mans are compulsive, the racing at Mosport recently, aspects of Long Beach, Watkins Glen, Monza.

I understand the ACO wanting Hypecar big, and we need pr teams in GT, but I think P2 has been giving us amazing stuff for a while now.

You have to keept hat, and then allow people like Ant, Goodwin, anyone else to tell you how hard it is for both aprties to make this happen,

Simmi · 29 Jul 2023, 08:29 (Ref:4170353)

Been looking at a potential WEC grid for next year. A process made more tricky by not being clear on the exact grid size. In his latest GT3 piece, GG saying it could now be as low as 34(!) due to air freight. I wonder if the new Qatar round has unlocked subsidised freight costs, but at the expense of a few grid slots?

I reckon we could end up with teams 'on the bubble' in both classes. For example, if we're at an odd number of full season Hypercars, I really don't see Vanwall staying on the grid at the expense of a manufacturer presence like Ford/Mercedes for example.

2x Toyota Gazoo
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Penske Porsche
2x Peugeot TE
2x BMW WRT
2x Cadillac CGR
2x Alpine
1x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
1x JOTA Porsche
1x Proton Porsche
1-2x Privateer Porsche TBC
1x Isotta Fraschini
…
1x Floyd V*nw*ll

2x Porsche Manthey
2x Corvette TF
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
2x BMW WRT
2x Lexus Akkodis ASP
2x Ford Proton
2x Aston TBC (HoR?)
…
2x Mercedes TBC

Have I missed anything (credible)?

Gerard C · 29 Jul 2023, 09:41 (Ref:4170366)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flatlandsman

I think LMP2 is superb, it is stable, the cars are quick and a little within their limits so slowed have they been, so they can be pushed very hard. The differences are minute and largely down the team work and strategy, as it should be./I understand the ACO wanting Hypecar big, and we need pr teams in GT, but I think P2 has been giving us amazing stuff for a while now.

+1

. PS: I don't care Netflix either.

tomcug · 29 Jul 2023, 10:01 (Ref:4170369)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

2x Cadillac CGR

Any source? I'd like to see two but I'm afraid will be only one again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

1x Floyd V*nw*ll

I don't think this will happen

Simmi · 29 Jul 2023, 10:16 (Ref:4170372)

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcug

Any source? I'd like to see two but I'm afraid will be only one again.

No to be fair - just a hopeful assumption. The latest I saw was this DSC piece where Laura wouldn't confirm numbers - https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...xt-season.html

It might be that a single car suits them given it effectively unlocks GT3 and additional entries at Le Mans. But if they're serious about actually winning in the top class in WEC I think a second car would be a major benefit.

**joeb** · 29 Jul 2023, 13:25 (Ref:4170404)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

Been looking at a potential WEC grid for next year. A process made more tricky by not being clear on the exact grid size. In his latest GT3 piece, GG saying it could now be as low as 34(!) due to air freight. I wonder if the new Qatar round has unlocked subsidised freight costs, but at the expense of a few grid slots?

I reckon we could end up with teams 'on the bubble' in both classes. For example, if we're at an odd number of full season Hypercars, I really don't see Vanwall staying on the grid at the expense of a manufacturer presence like Ford/Mercedes for example.

2x Toyota Gazoo
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Penske Porsche
2x Peugeot TE
2x BMW WRT
2x Cadillac CGR
2x Alpine
1x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
1x JOTA Porsche
1x Proton Porsche
1-2x Privateer Porsche TBC
1x Isotta Fraschini
…
1x Floyd V*nw*ll

2x Porsche Manthey
2x Corvette TF
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
2x BMW WRT
2x Lexus Akkodis ASP
2x Ford Proton
2x Aston TBC (HoR?)
…
2x Mercedes TBC

Have I missed anything (credible)?

Good list, don't know about the 2nd Caddy but with it that is already 36 cars. Do we know for sure there will be 2 additional 963 Porsches?

Simmi · 29 Jul 2023, 18:31 (Ref:4170449)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeb

Do we know for sure there will be 2 additional 963 Porsches?

There's nothing confirmed. That was just based on Porsche's own projections for customer cars - essentially doubling up their customer efforts in WEC and IMSA in year two. But things can change. Maybe it'll just be one additional car.

hondafan37 · 30 Jul 2023, 00:40 (Ref:4170485)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

Been looking at a potential WEC grid for next year. A process made more tricky by not being clear on the exact grid size. In his latest GT3 piece, GG saying it could now be as low as 34(!) due to air freight. I wonder if the new Qatar round has unlocked subsidised freight costs, but at the expense of a few grid slots?

I reckon we could end up with teams 'on the bubble' in both classes. For example, if we're at an odd number of full season Hypercars, I really don't see Vanwall staying on the grid at the expense of a manufacturer presence like Ford/Mercedes for example.

2x Toyota Gazoo
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Penske Porsche
2x Peugeot TE
2x BMW WRT
2x Cadillac CGR
2x Alpine
1x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
1x JOTA Porsche
1x Proton Porsche
1-2x Privateer Porsche TBC
1x Isotta Fraschini
…
1x Floyd V*nw*ll

2x Porsche Manthey
2x Corvette TF
2x Ferrari AF Corse
2x Lamborghini Iron Lynx
2x BMW WRT
2x Lexus Akkodis ASP
2x Ford Proton
2x Aston TBC (HoR?)
…
2x Mercedes TBC

Have I missed anything (credible)?

What about the Pescarolo Peugeot?

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...fort-for-2024/

**Adam43** · 30 Jul 2023, 00:52 (Ref:4170487)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIRE

Is the Pescarolo entry confirmed? IIRC the team is looking for budget.

Far from confirmed I think. Looking for budget is a more positive way to say "we have no budget".

Would be shocked if they made the grid.

**joeb** · 30 Jul 2023, 21:27 (Ref:4170709)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

There's nothing confirmed. That was just based on Porsche's own projections for customer cars - essentially doubling up their customer efforts in WEC and IMSA in year two. But things can change. Maybe it'll just be one additional car.

Possibly a topic for a different thread, but this led me to think that other manufacturers have no desire to sell customer cars, partly because there is no place for them to run. The WEC grid is full, and imsa is capping out at many tracks as well. If the series keep having multiple classes there just isn't space for anyone else.

Coach Ep · 31 Jul 2023, 00:40 (Ref:4170720)

I'm sure IMSA will happily give a couple of GTD the booth to make room for additional GTP entries. Especially with the big Italian fish!

flatlandsman · 31 Jul 2023, 08:57 (Ref:4170757)

Can someone explain to me why there even needs to be a cap on spaces? I get it that some tracks do not have room, but surely the series is good enough to go to places that do? or I am guessing they do not PAY as much!

Mike E · 31 Jul 2023, 09:45 (Ref:4170768)

Quote:

Originally Posted by flatlandsman

Can someone explain to me why there even needs to be a cap on spaces? I get it that some tracks do not have room, but surely the series is good enough to go to places that do? or I am guessing they do not PAY as much!

It's a combination of limited pit space and freight practicalities.

S griffin · 31 Jul 2023, 11:37 (Ref:4170794)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike E

It's a combination of limited pit space and freight practicalities.

Yes, there's only so many teams/entries they can fit in. We should be thankful they can fit in more than most other series

broadrun96 · 31 Jul 2023, 11:37 (Ref:4170795)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike E

It's a combination of limited pit space and freight practicalities.

Exactly that.

Where else would they go to open up more spaces? WEC would have to remain solely Euro series for costs, or get Qatar to kick in for another aircraft. But they are taking planes out of storage where before they were looking for places to keep them running. IMSA is in the same position with limited pit spacing being the biggest factor at many of the circuits

**joeb** · 31 Jul 2023, 11:43 (Ref:4170797)

On the good news side of things, Proton is planning to have 2 cars in WEC and IMSA next season full time if their entries are allowed.

https://www.dailysportscar.com/2023/...uji-debut.html

Total of 4 Proton cars expected.

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