BMW board to consider Sauber proposal.

[Super Tourer]

Mario Theissen, the head of BMW Motorsport is to propose to the BMW board of directors that the Munich company increase its investment in F1 and buy control of the Sauber team. The Swiss team is owned by the banking house Credit Suisse but Peter Sauber retains all the voting shares of the team, which means that he makes the decisions.

You may recall that Credit Suisse stepped in to buy Red Bull's Sauber shares when Red Bull disagreed with the driver choice of Raikkonen, they have also had to step up to the plate this year and increase their presence on the car to make up some of the short fall from the loss of Red Bull sponsorship.

Convincing Sauber to sell control of the team may not be a huge task, particularly if the deal means that he stays on in some titular role and enjoys motor racing without the responsibilities of being the team boss. Sauber is 61 and, while not really thinking of retirement, he might like an easier role. Theissen would be the new team principal, a role he clearly relishes.

Peter Sauber has made no secret of the fact that his team needs manufacturer support/partnership in order to move the performance forward, on the face of it the synergy between the two sides looks a logical fit.

Convincing the board of BMW will be another matter. BMW is disappointed with results that have been achieved with Williams in the last five years. Both sides must take some of the blame for that. The problem for Theissen is that having direct control will not necessarily guarantee better results, even if the team is run by Bavarian supermen. Sauber has had Ferrari engines for years but has yet to come close to the performance of the Italian team. Building up the team would require sizeable investment and would take time and during that phase of development there would be no guarantees of any big results.

How do you go about convincing a board of directors to throw even more money at something, on the basis that results will be better? Does more control equal better results? Clearly somethimg hasn't completely clicked between Williams and BMW, presumably BMW expected to have more results on the board by now.

Theissen's logic, according to our spies, is to stay with Williams as well, until Sauber is a success. This may sound like a wonderful idea for the men in Munich but it is hardly a vote of confidence in Williams and it is logical that in such a situation Williams would be on the lookout for an alternative engine partner with a little more faith.

Cosworth has been rumoured as a potential engine supplier for Williams should BMW take it's supply elsewhere, or indeed if SFW thinks that Williams will be relegated to bit part player instead of the star. The issue here is that BMW supply engines and sponsorship, Cosworth would require paying which would mean a substantial increase in sponsorship would be required, or Williams would have to cut it's cloth accordingly.

The fact that BMW are still looking at a team purchase despite the political backdrop is interesting, we have commented in the past how BMW sits around the GPWC table but has no team to enter in it's own right.

The question also remains, why not buy Williams enabling BMW to put right any ill's they see as holding back success? Would SFW sell? You would have to say it's very likely and that PH would probably take little persuasion. The trouble is that team values are not what they were 5 years ago, I believe that in the 'honeymoon' period, BMW did offer to buy into Williams but their offer was allegedly declined....

Extracts from.
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns14728.html

[grandprixdiary]

I'm sure this is just BMW rattling Franks cage. Buying into Sauber would get them a nice shiny wind tunnel but it will knock them back a couple of years from where they are now..

Rob

[Valve Bounce]

Originally Posted by grandprixdiary

I'm sure this is just BMW rattling Franks cage. Buying into Sauber would get them a nice shiny wind tunnel but it will knock them back a couple of years from where they are now..

Rob

Au contraire - my information is that it is already a done deal, and only the timing of the announcements needs to be made. I think even Frank had already conceded that BMW would go the Sauber way, although this is the subject of another and very much earlier thread here.

[Dani Filth]

i would hate to see Sauber disappear . just like Tyrell did

[Valve Bounce]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

i would hate to see Sauber disappear . just like Tyrell did

Dani - is that really a picture of you on your posts? I mean that is one helluva foxy lady.

[Dani Filth]

aaa no ...

BMW should start their own team . like Toyota did ..

[Valve Bounce]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

aaa no ...

[JohnSSC]

Interesting.

BMW may be facing the facts, which are at a time when they had (reputedly) the most powerful engine on the grid, Williams was providing a sled for a chassis. Yes, yes I know that there was a time ('03) when they did compete, but the chassis has never been as good as the engine. Now others have caught up and even Renault is making some serious oom pah pah.

What is an engine manufacturer to do?

While Williams is further up the food chain a purchase by BMW may not mean success - I think many there now would be gone after such a sale. Thise that are left may not have the warm fuzzies for BMW. Buying Sauber means much more of a "clean slate" plus all the infrastructure you need: just add boffins and go racing.

I would like to know how PS talked Credit Suisse into buying him a wind tunnel - bankers are a conservative lot and not prone to building random wind tunnels. Perhaps I can finally get that 3-Series I have been wanting...

[Russ-Turner]

I'd love to see Williams and Cosworth back together. The new Cossie is no slouch and with its history of v8's they shouldn't be too far behind on the game next year. But i guess we'll see.

[Kicking-back]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

I would like to know how PS talked Credit Suisse into buying him a wind tunnel - bankers are a conservative lot and not prone to building random wind tunnels. Perhaps I can finally get that 3-Series I have been wanting...

He didn't.

Mercedes paid for it as compensation for Raikkonen's contract

[Dani Filth]

sorry valve

[Sodemo]

I for one would welcome Sauber's disaperance if only to rid the grid of their horrid paint scheme.

Don't forget that Williams has a contract with BMW until 2009, any break of that deal would have to involve some kind of pay off to Williams...

[Dixie Flatline]

Originally Posted by The Monster

I for one would welcome Sauber's disaperance if only to rid the grid of their horrid paint scheme.

Don't forget that Williams has a contract with BMW until 2009, any break of that deal would have to involve some kind of pay off to Williams...

... Assuming that there are no performance milestones in the contract that allows one or other of the parties to terminate the agreement early. If I was drafting a contract to last that long, I would certainly like an option for an early exit if it looked like the relationship was not going to produce what I expected.

Going back to what was posted to grandprix.com, I was dubious because it appears to me to be simply speculation on the part of grandprix.com, with no quote attributed to anybody anywhere in the article - at least what I could detect.

[Super Tourer]

Originally Posted by The Monster

I for one would welcome Sauber's disaperance if only to rid the grid of their horrid paint scheme.

Don't forget that Williams has a contract with BMW until 2009, any break of that deal would have to involve some kind of pay off to Williams...

Possibly not too onerous - if you recall BMW deliberated long and hard over renewing it's contract with Williams, which Patrick Head has described as being on significantly less favourable financial terms.

It's also been alleged that it does not contain heavy penalties should BMW wish to terminate it early, and/or there are alleged performance clauses which if not met by the team, provide a relatively tangle free get out for BMW.

Possibly, with all the uncertainty ahead with the GPWC, BMW also wanted to leave the way clear for an easier exit.

[Dixie Flatline]

Originally Posted by Super Tourer

Possibly not too onerous - if you recall BMW deliberated long and hard over renewing it's contract with Williams, which Patrick Head has described as being on significantly less favourable financial terms.

It's also been alleged that it does not contain heavy penalties should BMW wish to terminate it early, and/or there are alleged performance clauses which if not met by the team, provide a relatively tangle free get out for BMW.

Possibly, with all the uncertainty ahead with the GPWC, BMW also wanted to leave the way clear for an easier exit.

Yes, I would have thought BMW would have renewed their agreement with Williams in this fashion.

[dcp2685]

Being a BMW fanatic, i would very much welcome a BMW works team in a similar way Toyota, Renault and Ferrari are.

And I agree Monster, that Sauber paint scheme is pretty horrid. Bring back the Motorsport stripes used in the 80's and Spaten as a nice sponsor.

[dcp2685]

Also, it looks like Nick Heidfeld would have a nice out next year. It would be interesting to see who they would sign for drivers considering Theissens support for Heidfeld.

[GTRMagic]

So why would BMW want to throw another couple of hundred million dollars at F1... when it has done all it can (or so it says) and underachieved? Hmmm.. sounds like the BMW-Rover deal

What makes Sauber such a catch, given that without manufacturer support, it is arguably not commercially viable.... no testing, a dud 2005 chassis and no money to fix it... not looking too clever....

BMW should buy Minardi... at least with those guys you know everything needs work...

[Jordi]

Shut up you lot - the Sauber paint-scheme is far better than half the grid, save for the yellow bargeboard.

Now seriously, I understand why BMW would want Sauber. Sauber has repeatedly said that this season they are down on money, but the infrastructure and knowledge seem to be in the team. They have a wind tunnel, the supercomputer. To me it's not like they have a bad chassis or bad equipment, it's just that they are not able to keep up development like Ferrari and Renault are. Pump a few millions into it, as well as having a BMW name in the grid as opposed to BMW.WilliamsF1 and it might well work.

[Adam43]

Nothing new, but Theissen has been making noises along the lines of this thread:

Originally Posted by Theissen

What I can confirm is that two months ago we entered into discussions with Sauber, it's well on its way. It's not just about money, it's about more - how to co-operate and make it work.

http://www.autosport-atlas.com/news.aspx?id=44005&s=5

[BootsOntheSide]

Williams haven't looked capable fo building a winning chassis, or even a better-than-anything-bar-Ferrari chassis, in a long time now. They seem to struggle to hang on to top talent, both driving and technical, and the managamenet structure seems to be flawed. Being able to run the team purely under the BMW name and image also has much more marketing potential (as long as things go right, but I don't think Toyota's problems so far have been disasterous for them friom a marketing angle - as long as they've finally got it right now).

[Yoong Montoya]

BMW should go with McLaren. Or are McLaren stuck with Mercedes?

[Adam43]

Mercedes own a stake in McLaren, so I can't see them changing to BMW engines.

[Nicholosophy]

Originally Posted by BootsOntheSide

Williams haven't looked capable fo building a winning chassis, or even a better-than-anything-bar-Ferrari chassis, in a long time now. They seem to struggle to hang on to top talent, both driving and technical, and the managamenet structure seems to be flawed. Being able to run the team purely under the BMW name and image also has much more marketing potential (as long as things go right, but I don't think Toyota's problems so far have been disasterous for them friom a marketing angle - as long as they've finally got it right now).

I remember reading an article recently where Williams were announcing a restructure, where they appointed a CEO (or similar position). Whilst SFW and PH were to oversee everything generally, I think this bloke was to be the day to day guy for running things.

This might make things better from a people management and skills management perspective. SFW and PH set the direction they want the team to go in, and the CEO (or whatever he is) gets everything in order to do it.

That's how I read the article...

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns14732.html

[GTRMagic]

Mr Newey.... come home please... all is forgiven....