[WEC] FIA World Endurance Championship

[NelisB]

Originally Posted by wewantourdarbyback

By about the second day me and Simmi had said we were coming back every year.

Same thing here. Went for the first time in 2008, loved it. Couldn't go due to school commitments in the next 2 years. Went last year and took some friends to Spa 6 hours. They're now also hooked and we've booked for this years le mans right after the race had finished.

[NelisB]

Originally Posted by wolfhound

Greaves have announced their line up in the WEC but no place for Tom Kimber- Smith in the WEC 0r LM24 hours but he will race in the LMS.
Elton Julian, Rcardo Gonzalez & Chrstian Zugel will do the driving.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/96903

Where does this put the announcement of Brundle and his son? Are they planning on entering 2 cars at Le Mans?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by NelisB

Where does this put the announcement of Brundle and his son? Are they planning on entering 2 cars at Le Mans?

Yes, Greaves are running one car in the WEC and one in the ELMS, the two are both entered for Le Mans based on the team's two automatic invites awarded for their 2011 performances. So the only missing piece of the puzzle is the third driver in the Brundle-Brundle-TBA car for Le Mans.

[wewantourdarbyback]

Feel sorry for Tom Kimber-Smith, hopefully he can find a drive for this season. He deserves it.

[Down F0rce]

It's a shame you didn't enjoy your first LM visist, Félix.

Le Mans is like any major sporting event... it will attract the die hard fans and, those who are just there for a **** up. You could say the same about any sport.

I went to the race by myself for three years, camping each time. I was dreading being stuck next to a bunch of yobs better suited to a banger racing track. First year at Beausejour - crowd was a bit rough, had no trouble though. Two years at Blu Sud and I was camped next to friendly Brits, which was great! Hung out at Tetre Rouge with some of the TT guys and their friends, it seemed a really chilled out site.

If you wanted to have a proper conversation with racing geeks you should have come along to the Ten Tenths meet! We're all there for the race, the partying is just an amusing distraction.

[DeathOrGlory]

The Brundle-Brundle car has an open slot? Put TK-S there.

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by DeathOrGlory

The Brundle-Brundle car has an open slot? Put TK-S there.

That seat may be closed already without it being announced yet. And TK-S right now has a deal with the team solely for the ELMS, he will partner Brundle Jr for the full season there.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

Originally Posted by wewantourdarbyback

To call the drivers 'amateurs' is to do them a disservice due to the rules giving them a name that doesn't apply to them.

I went to the Le Mans for the first time last year, and I have to say it was everything I expected and much more.

Did you explore the whole track? If you head down to Mulsanne for the sun rising on the Sunday, and watch the cars from inches away at Indianapolis/Arnage.

The access blows F1 out of the water, while it's not exactly open you can get amongst everything if you want. If you weren't delighted by a race that ended after 24 hours with two cars 13 seconds apart then I can't see how you can be a sportscar fan.

Exactly, at an F1 race you are treated like you're at the cinema, come in, pay stupid amounts of money, sit in one spot all day to watch the GP and a couple of sprint support races and then go home. I have heard circuits like Silverstone are different however. For me Le Mans was certainly a bigger race to attend than the multiple F1 GPs (mostly at Montreal) I've attended. Although to be honest, I felt both the Nurburgring 24h and American World of Outlaws Sprint cars in Pennsylvania were the most "epic" racing events I've been to in terms of atmosphere. Have not attended a GP since 2008, despite going to Grand Prixs since 1989, mostly because of value-for-money.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by The Badger

I went to Le Mans for the first time in 1989 , it was everything I expected , and heaps more . I havent stopped going , and have now been there over 25 times , and will continue to go as there is nothing comes near ..... and it still surprises me each year .

Originally Posted by AGD

There are personal perspectives and their are more objective perspectives. Would an ACO racing fan think that Le Mans is the biggest race in the world? I'm guessing so. News at 11. Fortunately, we have more objective measures to determine truth.

Originally Posted by JAG

Everyone who posts must have such a perspective but that perspective seems to be very different depending on where you're from.

From my perspective, being a working class husband and father of two, I feel I have very little chance of getting across the pond to the greatest sportscar race in the world, but some guy had a great idea to hold an event similar to this in my back yard that gave us a little slice of something great closer to home; once I went to my first, I have returned every year since, even under the worst of personal circumstances.

The decision to exclude said event from the WEC has a real chance of putting the event and my home track in jeopardy, hence my complete lack of jumping for joy at the formation of something that has potential for others, but seemingly only detriment for me.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by wewantourdarbyback

By about the second day me and Simmi had said we were coming back every year.

Well , to be honest , my bro and I said , every 2nd year ..... but we cant stay away either ..... lol ..... great isnt it !!!

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

From my perspective, being a working class husband and father of two, I feel I have very little chance of getting across the pond to the greatest sportscar race in the world, but some guy had a great idea to hold an event similar to this in my back yard that gave us a little slice of something great closer to home; once I went to my first, I have returned every year since, even under the worst of personal circumstances.

The decision to exclude said event from the WEC has a real chance of putting the event and my home track in jeopardy, hence my complete lack of jumping for joy at the formation of something that has potential for others, but seemingly only detriment for me.

Very well said ..... without all the conspiricy theorys . I understand how you feel , and would feel the same myself . I was planning on going myself one day ..... who knows , possibily again in the future .

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

From my perspective, being a working class husband and father of two, I feel I have very little chance of getting across the pond to the greatest sportscar race in the world, but some guy had a great idea to hold an event similar to this in my back yard that gave us a little slice of something great closer to home; once I went to my first, I have returned every year since, even under the worst of personal circumstances.

The decision to exclude said event from the WEC has a real chance of putting the event and my home track in jeopardy, hence my complete lack of jumping for joy at the formation of something that has potential for others, but seemingly only detriment for me.

I've actively avoided becoming embroiled in the WEC fallout/collateral for ALMS/ELMS discussions. But, on a personal note, I have genuine sympathy for those fans (such as yourself) whose 'home' event has been put in jeopardy (to varying degrees) by the direction in which the ACO has decided (or been forced) to take their racing.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

The decision to exclude said event from the WEC has a real chance of putting the event and my home track in jeopardy, hence my complete lack of jumping for joy at the formation of something that has potential for others, but seemingly only detriment for me.

I'd be gutted if there wasn't a UK WEC round, just as I was gutted when the ALMS scrapped their overseas rounds after 2001, and with it ELMS dissapeared after a single year despite support from teams and fans for it to continue. But for me motorsport is a once or twice a year day out, my loyalty is to watching the best racing, not a particular series. It's very different supporting your local sports team, in that case loyalty is everything, you turn out to watch them every other week, regardless of the quality on offer, there's a personal connection I don't get with an international TV event which motorsport at the WEC/ALMS level is.

On the point about a series or track being put in jeopardy because of a rival, that suggests there are deep rooted issues, holding on by a thread is a difficult position to be in and makes it difficult for outsiders (manufactuers, teams, sponsors) to commit long term, the ALMS and GA battle doesn't help.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by JAG

On the point about a series or track being put in jeopardy because of a rival, that suggests there are deep rooted issues, holding on by a thread is a difficult position to be in and makes it difficult for outsiders (manufactuers, teams, sponsors) to commit long term, the ALMS and GA battle doesn't help.

Huh? Petit's problems are caused by Grand-Am? Ummm, how about a no. Grand-Am isnt't the ALMS' partner who is scheduling over them without telling them anything. Grand-Am isn't forcing ALMS teams to go to the WEC if they want a shot at a LM entry. Heck, if ALMS teams want in Daytona or if GA teams want in at Sebring, they are free to do so (well, maybe not this year at Sebring, but that is a different but related story). So on and so forth. Petit has done just fine with Grand-Am in existence. The problem isn't Grand-Am. The problem is the ACO wanting the ALMS in the fold without actually wanting them in the fold and the even bigger problem is the ALMS seemingly allowing this to happen to the point that they have no control over their biggest race. It's not Grand-Am causing any of that. Frankly, I don't know why you keep bringing up Grand-Am. They are one of many sports car series. What's new? Not Grand-Am.

Also, you seriously underestimate what Petit and Road Atlanta mean to many fans. It's not some podunk regional Formula Vee race. It's a big, big deal to American road racing fans. It's a home race for many fans, sponsors, and influential media. It's not just important to the locals though.

[JHamilton]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

From my perspective, being a working class husband and father of two, I feel I have very little chance of getting across the pond to the greatest sportscar race in the world, but some guy had a great idea to hold an event similar to this in my back yard that gave us a little slice of something great closer to home; once I went to my first, I have returned every year since, even under the worst of personal circumstances.

The decision to exclude said event from the WEC has a real chance of putting the event and my home track in jeopardy, hence my complete lack of jumping for joy at the formation of something that has potential for others, but seemingly only detriment for me.

The race is great, and I love the ALMS, but for me the major concern is the track. I've spent the vast majority of my vacation there over the past decade. I'd be devastated if anything happened to it. It's all a house of cards.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by JAG

On the point about a series or track being put in jeopardy because of a rival, that suggests there are deep rooted issues, holding on by a thread is a difficult position to be in and makes it difficult for outsiders (manufactuers, teams, sponsors) to commit long term, the ALMS and GA battle doesn't help.

I agree with you, that there are deep rooted issues to begin with. The GA battle doesn't help, but had the ALMS been run as effectively as I think it should have, GA wouldn't be a factor or issue. In the end, I think it is simply mismanagement that causes the deep rooted issues, and allows GA to be an issue.

That the WEC is also a rival now, instead of a partner in growth, strikes me as silly and stupid. It didn't have to be this way, and we could have effectively had the same show.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

That the WEC is also a rival now, instead of a partner in growth, strikes me as silly and stupid. It didn't have to be this way, and we could have effectively had the same show.

There'll always be a balancing act between taking teams from existing series, attracting all new entrants and/or seeing them step up their efforts for a new challenge.

Toyota, Porsche, Strakka, JRM, would they be in WEC P1 without recent developments, I believe RISI had a WEC/GA choice, so were a loss to the ALMS regardless, but Level 5 may be fully commited to the ALMS now they'll face decent competition.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by JAG

There'll always be a balancing act between taking teams from existing series, attracting all new entrants and/or seeing them step up their efforts for a new challenge.

But there doesn't need to be.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by JAG

There'll always be a balancing act between taking teams from existing series, attracting all new entrants and/or seeing them step up their efforts for a new challenge.

A balancing act with the ACO putting a 20 pound weight on one side of the scale.

Toyota, Porsche, Strakka, JRM, would they be in WEC P1 without recent developments, I believe RISI had a WEC/GA choice, so were a loss to the ALMS regardless, but Level 5 may be fully commited to the ALMS now they'll face decent competition.

Toyota is cherry picking at the moment. Porsche? They can't be excited about the North American developments. Audi is probably in the same boat. Both may want a WC, but not in this fashion. Stuff like entries to Le Mans aren't relevant to them anyway. They'll get what they want regardless unless it is a pure Pre-Qing situation. Strakka has been planning on moving back to P1 for some time now. Remember, they were a P1 team before they found the HPD golden nugget. JRM, I don't know. Pescarolo probably isn't happy about the ELMS implosion especially with there being funding woes. Rebellion does not seem thrilled with the lack of an ELMS P1 option even if they plan on going on to the WEC. So on and so forth.

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Originally Posted by FordCosworthPanoz

Exactly, at an F1 race you are treated like you're at the cinema, come in, pay stupid amounts of money, sit in one spot all day to watch the GP and a couple of sprint support races and then go home. I have heard circuits like Silverstone are different however. For me Le Mans was certainly a bigger race to attend than the multiple F1 GPs (mostly at Montreal) I've attended.

I'd agree there. I've heard of a few friends who have travelled to Canada to watch the GP that they've felt disappointed by it compared to a track like Silverstone or Spa, mostly because the race in Canada is a park, and therefore it is hard to get around the track and watch from different places.

I've been fortunate to go to Silverstone numerous times, for the GP in '09 and '10, as well as events like the Silverstone Classic and the touring cars. The atmosphere has always been incredible, particularly in F1 with over 300,000 people there over the three days. Despite it arguably not being a particularly spectacular track to visit in terms of elevation changes, there are still some nice places to spectate from and it is easy to get about.

As F1 itself, it is very poor value for money compared to other events, like the GTs, sportscar racing and touring cars where you have much greater access to get close to the cars and stars in the paddock than you do with F1. If you get to meet an F1 driver at a race, it is either through luck or that you've simply paid a heck of a lot of money to get a paddock pass.

I've dreamt of getting to the Le Mans 24 hours for many years now, but have never been able to due to school, exams and other commitments too, but I hope to get there one day. I think it is a harder event to sell to your friends though than say a Grand Prix. To put it bluntly, I guess F1 is the idiot's favourite racing where you have to have a deeper knowledge of motorsport to appreciate what Le Mans is with the different classes, etc.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Thaw Daggerslash

To put it bluntly, I guess F1 is the idiot's favourite racing where you have to have a deeper knowledge of motorsport to appreciate what Le Mans is with the different classes, etc.

F1 (and most forms of professional racing) are very personality driven. The personalities of the drivers, owners, team bosses, and series bosses are all a big deal. A big circus. With sports car racing, this isn't really the case so much. There are emotional attachments and beloved drivers and all of that, but there isn't as much of a circus atmosphere (not counting the drunks at the track - they are everywhere). It's more bureaucratic for better or for worse. It does take a lot of focus to understand the classes, procedures, and the rules. Most of us get confused about things from time to time and we are the diehards who live for this stuff. It seems that things have to be relearned every year.

But, anyway, F1 and their participants have the aloof reputation. American racing, especially stuff like drag racing, is on the total opposite end of the spectrum. The participants understand what and who pays the bills and so they give the fans what they want when they can. Many of the participants came from more humble beginnings and may have started in the sport at a much older age. Sports car racing is kind of in the middle between the poles.

I don't know if I'd call F1 fans idiots. There are probably just as many or more F1 fans who have a deep technical and business knowledge of the sport as there are with sports cars, but they aren't as visible because the "your favorite driver sucks" and "my daddy is faster than your daddy" crowd is even bigger and much more annoying. Certainly F1 is more stable and easier to follow, that's for dang sure. That may be more of a flaw of sports car racing than a dumbed down point of F1 and other series.

[Gingers4Justice]

Originally Posted by Thaw Daggerslash

I've dreamt of getting to the Le Mans 24 hours for many years now, but have never been able to due to school, exams and other commitments too, but I hope to get there one day. I think it is a harder event to sell to your friends though than say a Grand Prix. To put it bluntly, I guess F1 is the idiot's favourite racing where you have to have a deeper knowledge of motorsport to appreciate what Le Mans is with the different classes, etc.

It's not if you pitch it correctly, I've been able to persuade a few friends to come with me.

If you think a Grand Prix has a good atmosphere, then Le Mans at the pit straight at 3 o'clock on the Saturday will blow your mind. It's a different ballpark.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Thaw Daggerslash

I've dreamt of getting to the Le Mans 24 hours for many years now, but have never been able to due to school, exams and other commitments too, but I hope to get there one day. I think it is a harder event to sell to your friends though than say a Grand Prix. To put it bluntly, I guess F1 is the idiot's favourite racing where you have to have a deeper knowledge of motorsport to appreciate what Le Mans is with the different classes, etc.

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

It's not if you pitch it correctly, I've been able to persuade a few friends to come with me.

If you think a Grand Prix has a good atmosphere, then Le Mans at the pit straight at 3 o'clock on the Saturday will blow your mind. It's a different ballpark.

If your Dane, you are most likely to go to Le Mans before F1!
But this is mostly of nationalistic reasons (Tom K and J. Magnussen especially) and the general atmosphere of racing by day, and beer party at night! (we danes like beer! )
But this should go to the "who's going" thread soon

[vyselegend]

Sorry if this was already mentioned, but I just noticed the WEC official website is beta-running already:

http://www.fiawec.com/

Let's hope they make it clean and practical...

[Fogelhund]

I don't know if any of you are following DSC and/or Dagys on twitter. There is some doubt (speculative) as to whether the Peugeot program will actually go forward this year.