Dome LMP Discussion

[P38 in workshop]

It would be wonderful to see the combination of Dome and Pescarolo on the podium.Definitely one to watch with interest.

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

The TS030 was fully designed and built by TMG, apart from the powertrain which was TMC. Dome were not involved in the TS030

*Sam's signed NDAs with various parties, he's contractually obligated to say this. ;0)

[Aysedasi]

OK then Sam, not calling you out as such, but how do you prove the statement that Dome were not involved?

[flor]

Why would they?

[alexkiller8]

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

It would be wonderful to see the combination of Dome and Pescarolo on the podium.Definitely one to watch with interest.

with 4 audi r18 in grid will be insanely hard for toyota to reach the podium, much more for dome/pescarolo. Afterall as releaved by them self, dome objective is more to do a good qualifying than a good race.
Maybe they will exit from the pits for their time attack just last minutes when there is less traffic and the track is fully rubbered, with maybe 10L in fueltank, warmed super soft tyres and lowest downforce possible (and bourdais drunk of redbull)

[Aysedasi]

And I'll be sitting there waiting to watch it!

[I love 04s]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

What the Dome - or the Toyota? For me, the Dome is very pretty indeed. If they can blend the BHF in well, all the better.....

No no! I quite agree the Dome car is very pretty. I mean the politics between Dome and Toyota are clearly not pretty!

[I love 04s]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

The TS030 was fully designed and built by TMG, apart from the powertrain which was TMC. Dome were not involved in the TS030

[ss_collins]

OK then Sam, not calling you out as such, but how do you prove the statement that Dome were not involved?

As I say Dome was not involved in the TS030, aside from the power train testing at Sugo in 2008, where they found the hybrid system to be too heavy (Toyota confirm this in print in the next issue of RCE). The TS030 project was started in Cologne not long after Toyota quit F1. WTCC and IRC I think were also considered and we have all seen the pic of the mystery GT Lexus.
Not even Dome's rather good wind tunnel was used (Toyota use it for the GT500 car) instead the TS030 was developed at the twin tunnels at TMG, Dome would only ever use its own tunnels to develop a car.

Is Mike right about Dome wanting to prove something - yes of course - Hayashi wants to prove that Japanese motorsport engineering is as good or better than anyone else in the world he wants to prove to the corporate types in Tokyo that Dome would have been a better choice. He hates that Japanese forms always buy engineering from outside of Japan. Perhaps Honda will take note or even Subaru/Mitsubishi etc.

[Gil Abobeleira]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

...and we have all seen the pic of the mystery GT Lexus.

Is there a picture of this Lexus GT?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by Gil Abobeleira

Is there a picture of this Lexus GT?

http://www.autoguide.com/gallery/gal..._lfa_gte_1.JPG

[Félix]

Well Henri Pescarolo seems to know what happened... and he's saying more with each interview. (He also describes the AMR-One as *something I can't write here* in this one):http://www.autonewsinfo.com/2012/02/...tos-37409.html

"They had worked on it a lot, maybe for a Japanese manufacturer, and then the game changed and they were looking for the ideal team to run it. (it's an ex-OAK employee who told them about Pescarolo Team) I accepted because it was a good bet for the future at a time when my future was rather bleak."

Personally, I'd say Dome is frustrated because there were contacts with Toyota; they probably took a good look at the car and Dome kept developing it for them. Then, they went with their own car - but most of us agree that it looks a lot like an S102 tub. I can understand their frustration.

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by Félix

Well Henri Pescarolo seems to know what happened... and he's saying more with each interview. (He also describes the AMR-One as *something I can't write here* in this one):http://www.autonewsinfo.com/2012/02/...tos-37409.html

Okay, I'll be brave enough to write it, he says that the AMR-One was wrong and cr*p in every aspect except for the monocoque/chassis.

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

As I say Dome was not involved in the TS030, aside from the power train testing at Sugo in 2008, where they found the hybrid system to be too heavy (Toyota confirm this in print in the next issue of RCE). The TS030 project was started in Cologne not long after Toyota quit F1. WTCC and IRC I think were also considered and we have all seen the pic of the mystery GT Lexus.
Not even Dome's rather good wind tunnel was used (Toyota use it for the GT500 car) instead the TS030 was developed at the twin tunnels at TMG, Dome would only ever use its own tunnels to develop a car.

All of what you say is true. None of that's in doubt. It's what hasn't been mentioned that makes the Dome-Toyota connection still very valid and isn't' explained away or even addressed by the above. And by Henri's mutterings there are a LOT of people that know about this. Toyota should just address it and come clean.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

All of what you say is true. None of that's in doubt. It's what hasn't been mentioned that makes the Dome-Toyota connection still very valid and isn't' explained away or even addressed by the above. And by Henri's mutterings there are a LOT of people that know about this. Toyota should just address it and come clean.

Well it's like a big pink elephant in the room, which no one dare to speak about.

Or in the children story: "The Emperor's New Clothes" by H.C. Andersen, the "naked" emperor whom no one truly addresses until someone breaks the silence.

[Gil Abobeleira]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

http://www.autoguide.com/gallery/gal..._lfa_gte_1.JPG

Thanks

[TF110]

Dome has their car, Toyota has their car- play along and race! That's how I feel. Toyota really didn't need DOME's help. They may have taken it (their help), and maybe their concept for a car/chassis, but do we have proof? Is this what DOME is upset about? Or is it that they really wanted Toyota backing and for the credit to be made to them? This information doesn't really even matter to me. Because it happens in other forms of life, and in other business practices. I hope good fortunes to both of these cars.

[cmk]

It sounds as though Dome is particularly interested in making a run for the pole. Is Mr. Sarrazin available now that he's put the 908HY4 to bed at Sartory?

[isynge]

Originally Posted by cmk

It sounds as though Dome is particularly interested in making a run for the pole. Is Mr. Sarrazin available now that he's put the 908HY4 to bed at Sartory?

One is minded of Audi's comment about Pescarolo in 2006, when there was the hint that maybe the R10 might be beatable, that they'd never seen so many qualifying tyres thrown at an effort to get pole - suspect with Messrs Bourdais and Minassian involved we might just see something a bit similar come June.

[Aysedasi]

We can only hope so Ian!!!

[Articus]

But then there's the inevitable outcome of Toyota trying to snub a Dome LM24 Pole by saying that they were not racing for pole/its a long race/we qualified on the race setup/we used hard tires/you know how it goes. Of course I will not believe that for a split second .

[templer]

Well we will perhaps never know exactly that was Dome's part in a Toyota LMP development and what was not. What is sure that Toyota has one of most advanced facilities at TMG and they don't need Dome to develop such a car tough the TS030 has strong similarities to the S102.

Beside that Dome did a fantastic job with their car and that was well recognised by technicians on the grid, but if they really did only start this year to show Toyota what they can do, it would be sad. Cause they don't really think that they can outpace a totally new car with a Judd engine and aerodynamics only updated to the new rules. No way, even not on one single lap. The TS030 features a more powerful engine with hybrid technology and features also a more advanced aerodynamics ( front splitter, whole rear end) and they will for sure also have suspension advantage.

So I hope Dome concentrate on what they can do and don't dream from any things that will never come true

[TF110]

The TS030 has some SuperGT influence on it as well, people say Toyota has been out of Sports car racing for a long time, which is false. The SuperGT program has never ceased, and those cars put lap times in that could put them right in the mix of LMP2s. These are GT's that weigh 1100kg though. The DOME does look great, and I hope they have serious speed. But going fast over one lap isn't going to be enough to boost their appeal IMO. Maybe Pescarolo can make it last though, even if they don't do the 24hr tests. Spa may be the determining factor. If they can make it through that race, I feel they'll have a chance to last at least until night fall at LeMans. I don't think they'll be faster than Toyota though. Maybe Rebellion Toyota!

[I love 04s]

Originally Posted by MulsanneMike

And by Henri's mutterings there are a LOT of people that know about this. Toyota should just address it and come clean.

Hear hear.

[alexkiller8]

realisticly i don't know how dome 102 car has been really developed and updated since 2008 (update doesn't mean only apply new mandatory spec parts). For sure in my opinion do a good qualifying using a killer setting is much more easier than do a good race, for this reason i'm pretty sure that they will be fast in qual. running with the pace of best private petrol cars.