Ferrari P1 Rumours

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

If we do happen to see a P1, it's likely going to be a factory designed, Michelotto/Dallara built customer car. With the engine regs being what they are, and some better equivalency between petrol and diesel, it potentially would allow Ferrari to enter a customer car. If this happens, which it likely wont, I would expect to see in no sooner than 2015, probably 2016.

Dallara helping Audi and Ferrari...I don't think so.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by Velociraptor

FIAT is in a very bad situation.
If they don't succeed in buying full stake in Chrysler, they might be looking at bankruptcy and selling off their brands.
I highly doubt they have resources to invest in a LMP1 project.

http://www.ferrari.com/english/about...i-history.aspx

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Salamus

Dallara helping Audi and Ferrari...I don't think so.

They are an independent shop, they will take on the business they are given, you'd have to be a complete buffoon to turn down that business. Let us not forget that Ferrari could build in house if they wanted.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by deggis

You forgot certain Japanese manufacturer's (Honda) re-entry to F1, which has been actually officially announced & confirmed unlike this certain other Japanese manufacturer's (Nissan) at this point completely imaginery P1 entry

Honda going to F1 with McLaren. Thats an engine deal. So its not adding a new team. That makes McLaren Mercedes and Ferrari as the only manufacturers with F1 teams. In lmp theres Audi Porsche and Toyota. Honda customer cars and engines. The latter just like F1.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by TF110

Honda going to F1 with McLaren. Thats an engine deal. So its not adding a new team. That makes McLaren Mercedes and Ferrari as the only manufacturers with F1 teams. In lmp theres Audi Porsche and Toyota. Honda customer cars and engines. The latter just like F1.

Guess who said "manufacturers" and not "teams"? http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=140

[TF110]

Originally Posted by deggis

Guess who said "manufacturers" and not "teams"? http://tentenths.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=140

Did I offend you? You try to counter my reasons of Ferrari wanting manufacturer competition in lmp by saying Honda will be in F1. Theyre doing an engine not an entry. Thats about the same involvement in lmp. Except in lmp theres a car option. Youre mentioning engine makes, but how many engine makers are in lmp?

[deggis]

Originally Posted by TF110

Did I offend you? You try to counter my reasons of Ferrari wanting manufacturer competition in lmp by saying Honda will be in F1. Theyre doing an engine not an entry. Thats about the same involvement in lmp. Except in lmp theres a car option. Youre mentioning engine makes, but how many engine makers are in lmp?

My reply had nothing to do with Ferrari but with your weird logic of including Nissan as an involved future manufacturer in P1 and then excluding Honda in F1. And originallly you said F1 has 3, you did mean Ferrari, Renault and Merc, didn't you?

Totally wouldn't compare what HPD is doing and what will Honda will be doing in P1. Here is already the first difference: "HPD" vs. "Honda".

[TF110]

Originally Posted by deggis

My reply had nothing to do with Ferrari but with your weird logic of including Nissan as an involved future manufacturer in P1 and then excluding Honda in F1. And originallly you said F1 has 3, you did mean Ferrari, Renault and Merc, didn't you?

Totally wouldn't compare what HPD is doing and what will Honda will be doing in P1. Here is already the first difference: "HPD" vs. "Honda".

You should cool your vendetta. HPD is a part of Honda first of all, so where's the "difference". My logic isn't "weird" by saying 5 manufacturers IF Honda and Nissan are present. Renault is not a team. They're an engine maker and a shadow of their former self. So the 3 manufacturers that I already said that you even quoted was Mercedes Ferrari and McLaren.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by TF110

You should cool your vendetta.

Looks like I can't reply to you now without you playing that card.

HPD is a part of Honda first of all, so where's the "difference".

In branding, in amount of financial support. Compare to when the HPDs were called Acuras and multiply.

Secondly, the engine deal with McLaren is exclusive at least for 2015. If this was happenning LMP, naturally it would be of course a de facto works team... I sense some self-deception here.

My logic isn't "weird" by saying 5 manufacturers IF Honda and Nissan are present. Renault is not a team. They're an engine maker and a shadow of their former self. So the 3 manufacturers that I already said that you even quoted was Mercedes Ferrari and McLaren.

If you are indeed talking about "manufacturers", then count them all too regardless of whether they have own teams or not. Which you are not doing if you exclude Renault and Honda. And speaking of teams then, e.g. Strakka wouldn't be a "Honda Factory Team" either.

Also if Nissan is ok to count in, can I also add a hypothetical manufacturer to F1?

[TF110]

Originally Posted by deggis

Looks like I can't reply to you now without you playing that card.

You seem to be getting critical about someone's speculation... its not that serious.

In branding, in amount of financial support. Compare to when the HPDs were called Acuras and multiply.

They say HONDA RACING right on the side of the fin currently Somehow thats not Honda?

Secondly, the engine deal with McLaren is exclusive at least for 2015. If this was happenning LMP, naturally it would be of course a de facto works team... I sense some self-deception here.

Who said anything about "works teams" in lmp? I said manufacturers involved. Honda/HPD having a car and engine is a manufacturer, no matter who runs it. Unlike F1 where teams have only customer engines as an option.

If you are indeed talking about "manufacturers", then count them all too regardless of whether they have own teams or not. Which you are not doing if you exclude Renault and Honda. And speaking of teams then, e.g. Strakka wouldn't be a "Honda Factory Team" either.

Also if Nissan is ok to count in, can I also add a hypothetical manufacturer to F1?

I said IF. And now for a third time. No one said factory or works teams in lmp. I said manufacturers. Manufacturers can make customer options in lmp, you don't see that in F1. All you see is small teams and a drink maker throwing billions at a single cause without care.

This thread is a rumor speculation thread. Whats the point in getting critical over reasons Ferrari might think of lemans?

[Maelochs]

So, it's another one of these, eh? Meh.

Agreeing to disagree and moving on is an option.

[Simmi]

EDIT: nvm

[deggis]

Originally Posted by TF110

You seem to be getting critical about someone's speculation... its not that serious.

It's not, but you are also replying, so it is serious enough

They say HONDA RACING right on the side of the fin currently Somehow thats not Honda?

It is Honda, but you know very well why Strakka or Muscle is not called Honda Racing +Strakka/+Muscle Milk, why the chassis is called HPD and clearly they don't receive much financial support either currently quite highlighted by the fact that the other team has dropped out.

Who said anything about "works teams" in lmp? I said manufacturers involved. Honda/HPD having a car and engine is a manufacturer, no matter who runs it. Unlike F1 where teams have only customer engines as an option.

I said IF. And now for a third time. No one said factory or works teams in lmp. I said manufacturers. Manufacturers can make customer options in lmp, you don't see that in F1. All you see is small teams and a drink maker throwing billions at a single cause without care.

Please explain to me again why Renault (and Honda in 2015) as car manufacturers providing engines to a series called F1 are not manufacturers involved in F1? This is the part I'm not getting.

This thread is a rumor speculation thread. Whats the point in getting critical over reasons Ferrari might think of lemans?

I don't understand the question because I'm not talking about Ferrari. To me this feels like this type of deja vu thing again, where you first say something, then just somehow can't directly admit that you could have worded it better or more clearly ("manufacturers" vs "teams") and then then it gets to pointless semantics.

[JacobP]

Originally Posted by Velociraptor

FIAT is in a very bad situation.
If they don't succeed in buying full stake in Chrysler, they might be looking at bankruptcy and selling off their brands.
I highly doubt they have resources to invest in a LMP1 project.

FIAT doesn't need to invest in the project. Ferrari is not just a FIAT brand. Ferrari is an independent company, but FIAT happens to be a majority share holder. If Ferrari decides to enter LMP racing, I assume they will be using their own resources.

It's quite an entertaining discussion about whether it will suite Ferrari to enter P1 prototypes. I think Ferrari might at very least play with the idea of Le Mans return simply due to new engine regulations. However, at the same time, this may all be just talk. Sort of like Audi kept taking about F1 return if engine regs finally changed.. and then just talked away. In LMP1, Ferrari will be forced to fight against others on equal footing with little financial return from participation. In F1, Ferrari can lose title fight to Red Bull, and yet still collect a bigger share of TV right money than the later.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by deggis

It's not, but you are also replying, so it is serious enough

Seemed like you were getting offended by my opinions.

It is Honda, but you know very well why Strakka or Muscle is not called Honda Racing +Strakka/+Muscle Milk, why the chassis is called HPD and clearly they don't receive much financial support either currently quite highlighted by the fact that the other team has dropped out.

I realize that. Honda Racing is badged on there. Theres no financial support from Renault to Lotus or Williams. Infinity (part of nissan-renault) just jumped on the Red Bull bandwagon as a title sponsor.

Please explain to me again why Renault (and Honda in 2015) as car manufacturers providing engines to a series called F1 are not manufacturers involved in F1? This is the part I'm not getting.

Renault is not a team. They supply an engine. This has been the case for the past two seasons but Ferrari still say they want to race manufacturers. Thats where I think going to lmp would appeal to them.

I don't understand the question because I'm not talking about Ferrari. To me this feels like this type of deja vu thing again, where you first say something, then just somehow can't directly admit that you could have worded it better or more clearly ("manufacturers" vs "teams") and then then it gets to pointless semantics.

I worded it just fine. Ferrari want to race manufacturers. Obviously they feel that being an engine maker is not equal racing as a manufacturer. The "team" word I used because you seemed to misinterpret what I feel Ferrari is talking about (manufacturer teams). Honda wont come in as a team or a constructor, but if they plan on using a hybrid car at LeMans, thats the class theyll be in.

[Adam43]

OK, I think we're done with that line of interesting debate.
Maelochs makes a very good point.

[TF110]

What happens if AF Corse is no longer in the wec?

[Pandemonium]

Guys take a look at this is pretty recent. We are still getting an answer from ferrari before the year ends right?
http://www.automoto.it/news/ferrari-...mans-2015.html

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by Pandemonium

Guys take a look at this is pretty recent. We are still getting an answer from ferrari before the year ends right?
http://www.automoto.it/news/ferrari-...mans-2015.html

There is no need for an answer since there never was a question.

[Maelochs]

I don't know what that thing is but it doesn't look like a P1---maybe the photos don't show it properly.

[Mal]

Nice idea - but I am led to believe they are using that as a test mule for the 2014 F1 engine.

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by Mal

Nice idea - but I am led to believe they are using that as a test mule for the 2014 F1 engine.

By all accounts it's a LaFerrari chassis with the 2014 F1 powertrain (or at least the engine part of it).

[hondafan37]

The front seems the 458 GTE.
3 questions:
1) This car could be the Laferrari Evo XX, but why do you use the F1 V6 hybrid in this car?
2) The car looks like a LMP1 EVO, Just missing the rear wing.
Could Ferrari request the LMP 1 EVO return?
3) If is a F1 test:
Does it make sense to test an F1 engine on a GT?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by hondafan37

Could Ferrari request the LMP 1 EVO return?
3) If is a F1 test:
Does it make sense to test an F1 engine on a GT?

According to what many people are saying, the V8 F1 engine that got introduced back in 2006 first ran on track in the back of an Enzo test mule in 2005.

[Rodger Davies]

Originally Posted by hondafan37

The front seems the 458 GTE.
3 questions:
1) This car could be the Laferrari Evo XX, but why do you use the F1 V6 hybrid in this car?
2) The car looks like a LMP1 EVO, Just missing the rear wing.
Could Ferrari request the LMP 1 EVO return?
3) If is a F1 test:
Does it make sense to test an F1 engine on a GT?

1) testing restrictions

2) no

3) yes, for durability and reliability