[BTCC] BTCC 2020 season discussion, News and Rumours!

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by AnnoyedMoose

Good to see Bushell getting a run and he'll give some quality feedback as well. Be interesting to see the other drivers they have lined up.

http://www.btcc.net/2020/08/19/pmr-b...k-in-the-btcc/

Guess it's all over for Mat Jackson with regards to his return. Not necessarily so of course but still....

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by Nononsensecapeesh

Guess it's all over for Mat Jackson with regards to his return. Not necessarily so of course but still....

Could always sign a contract with Sauber

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Could always sign a contract with Sauber

LOL! Still a bummer there's no mention of him but great to have Bushnell back and PMR.

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by Nononsensecapeesh

LOL! Still a bummer there's no mention of him but great to have Bushnell back and PMR.

Darn predictive text, I meant Bushell.

[S griffin]

I hope it’s not the end for MJ and we see him back out next season at least, as he’s clearly eager to return

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by S griffin

I hope it’s not the end for MJ and we see him back out next season at least, as he’s clearly eager to return

My sentiments exactly

[redshoes]

No spectators at Knockhil
https://www.knockhill.com/wordpress/...ticket-update/

Scottish govt will allow spectators but limited to just 200. Knockhill have decided that there is no way they can fairly select which ticket holders will be allowed in so will run behind closed doors.

Thruxton have recently emailed out to ticket holders to say that they will be closed as well, and Silverstone had already said no spectators, so it will be Croft in Oct at the earliest before anyone gets trackside.

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by Nononsensecapeesh

Guess it's all over for Mat Jackson with regards to his return. Not necessarily so of course but still....

Not really... Plato's sponsorship is being carried over into 2021, so there's no reason why they'd wouldn't try and do the same for Mat. Obviously they have different sponsors but it's definitely not all over.

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by Evantra

Not really... Plato's sponsorship is being carried over into 2021, so there's no reason why they'd wouldn't try and do the same for Mat. Obviously they have different sponsors but it's definitely not all over.

Well, let's hope not, there's been little if any mention of MJ since PMR originally pulled out of the 2020 season. Wonder who will get a chance after Bushell's tenure ends since he's only doing two meetings? For now that is.

[bella]

Originally Posted by redshoes

No spectators at Knockhil
https://www.knockhill.com/wordpress/...ticket-update/

Scottish govt will allow spectators but limited to just 200. Knockhill have decided that there is no way they can fairly select which ticket holders will be allowed in so will run behind closed doors.

Thruxton have recently emailed out to ticket holders to say that they will be closed as well, and Silverstone had already said no spectators, so it will be Croft in Oct at the earliest before anyone gets trackside.

200 is laughable and deliberately low to make it not worthwhile.

these decisions are being made by people with no idea what they’re talking about and they’re not listening to the people who do.

[S griffin]

200 is better than none at all, but I agree with Knockhill, it's hard to pick out the ticket holders with that number

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Evantra

Not really... Plato's sponsorship is being carried over into 2021, so there's no reason why they'd wouldn't try and do the same for Mat. Obviously they have different sponsors but it's definitely not all over.

I think the ball is in Jackson's court with this one.

JP has been referred to as having a contract by PMR.
MJ was referred to as having 'first option' in their releases.

To me, that sounds like a 'bring us the money in '21 and the seat's yours'. It's up to MJ to secure those funds though, and his personal sponsors haven't confirmed yet.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Originally Posted by bella

200 is laughable and deliberately low to make it not worthwhile.

these decisions are being made by people with no idea what they’re talking about and they’re not listening to the people who do.

They are letting 1000 into Murrayfield stadium For a Edinburgh-Glasgow rugby game , so 200 around the perimeter of a motor racing circuit is difficult to understand.

1000 would easily be manageable and well socially distanced around Knockhill. Especially as it’s unlikely to be 1000 individuals, but many small groupings, ie a car load or a family groups.

[bella]

i think they had several thousand at oulton for british gt (it was 1600 on the saturday), and possibly similar numbers at donington. there don’t seem to be any comments about it being too busy and it didn’t look horrendous on tv either.

seems to be a competitive abundance of caution going on. personally i think it’d be smarter to allow team guests to attend but stay outside the paddock, that way at least some value can be extracted from sponsorship.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Knockhill said they have 600+ car only or all event season ticket holders, and were looking to at least get those plus some of those who had purchased advanced tickets in.

[touringlegend]

For 200 it’s just not worth the hassle of providing gate staff catering etc.

Seems mad when my local Asda is allowed to have over 500

[mprmke]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I think the ball is in Jackson's court with this one.

JP has been referred to as having a contract by PMR.
MJ was referred to as having 'first option' in their releases.

To me, that sounds like a 'bring us the money in '21 and the seat's yours'. It's up to MJ to secure those funds though, and his personal sponsors haven't confirmed yet.

Yes, it is that simple. Plato is confirmed as everything is in place for him. Jackson has first option on the seat as it would have been his for this year, but obviously he has to provide the backing. He can’t confirm whether he can or can’t do that yet, but let’s hope he can.

[touringlegend]

So David Addison has just stated on the qualifying PMR are back as they have been reminded of the need to keep their TBL. Confusing as I thought there would have been leeway this year

[S griffin]

Maybe so, but maybe TOCA are saying they only need to run one car to keep both their TBLs, instead of having to run two. Or maybe PMR just had a quick check of the rulebook just to be sure?

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by bella

200 is laughable and deliberately low to make it not worthwhile.

these decisions are being made by people with no idea what they’re talking about and they’re not listening to the people who do.

I don't know how the authorities arrived at the figure of 200 but I do have a degree of sympathy with the situation. I suspect it's a standard figure for all 'outside events'. Doesn't matter if in BTCC at Knockhill or the local village fete, the limit is 200 regardless. In all likelihood they are either unwilling or unable to individually assess every event and every venue of it's own merits.

[Moneyseeker]

No spectators at Silverstone either - they have taken all event tickets off sale until events in October so far.

[WestHam92]

Hi everyone, this is my first post on the forum. I'd like to talk about a few issues I have with the BTCC and wanted to get your thoughts.

I've been watching the championship for over twenty years, following it for ten and have gone to Snetterton every year for nearly ten years. I really enjoy watching the championship but some things about it frustrate me.

My main complaint with it is how it can seem a bit amateurish at times. Take the incident with Carl Boardley on the formation lap of the first race at Oulton Park. Boardley makes a rather stupid mistake and crashes into the barriers at the final corner and it then takes over half an hour for the barriers to be repaired. For the record, I know how important marshals are to any motor racing event going ahead and I commend all of them for doing it. However, every time there's an incident in the BTCC that requires a car to be cleared away or barriers to be repaired, I expect there to be a lengthy delay. The marshals take ages to do things that are done much quicker in other racing series. Is it that the facilities at the circuits don't allow for these things to be done quickly, an issue with the marshals themselves, or something else?

Talking of Carl Boardley, he's one of the drivers in this year's championship who I have a bit of a gripe with. He was able to buy a BMW 1 Series from WSR, so he's not short of money but does seem a bit short of talent. He had a rather poor season last year in a rather bad car, so when I saw the news that he'd bought the BMW, I was prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt and judge him on how he performs this season. From what I've seen so far, I'm not impressed. Look at how Boardley has performed compared to Stephen Jelley in the same car with the same engine. Jelley is 12th with 43 points and Boardley is 22nd with six. He should be doing far better in a car as good as the 1 Series and his results lead me to believe that he isn't good enough for the championship.

The same goes for Michael Crees. I know he's popular, but is he any good? He's 17th with 23 points in a car that won three races last season. His teammates Tom Chilton and Josh Cook are 8th and 15th - albeit after a difficult start to the season. Without the disqualification at Oulton Park, Cook would be far higher up the standings. It's pretty clear that Crees is only in that car because of the sponsorship he brings. Getting a drive that way is fine if you can back it up with results, but so far this season he hasn't.

I understand that motor racing's history is built upon wealthy amateurs taking part and I have no problem with that as long as those wealthy amateurs are good enough. The BTCC has plenty of examples of amateurs who have paid their way in but have performed well enough to be deserving of a drive year after year.

It's no coincidence that it's usually been the same five drivers finishing near the back this season. Those five drivers currently occupy the bottom five positions of the standings (I'm excluding Mike Bushell as he's only competed at one round). I'm assuming that all of them have bought their way into the championship in some way or another, either through buying a car, sponsorship or just writing a cheque. Boardley, Brown, Neate, Butel and Hamilton clearly aren't good enough for the BTCC and their results prove that.

This brings me back to my earlier point about the series being a bit amateurish. The rules allow drivers with little experience and/or ability (in relative terms to other drivers in the championship) to compete if they've got the funds to do so, but if it turns out they're not up to standard it means the overall quality of the championship is lowered. It's supposed to be Britain's "premier motor racing series", but it seems like a bit of a hobby for some. There are too many drivers trying their best but getting nowhere. How can drivers with too much money and not enough ability keep racing in the BTCC year after year?

I know there will be people on here who'll say that professionals competing against amateurs is part of the appeal of the BTCC, but is it appealing to see the same drivers doing badly all the time? Do you applaud them for turning up and having a go or do you wonder why they're there and want something done about it?

That doesn't even cover my other (smaller) issues with the championship, but I'll leave those for now!

[AnnoyedMoose]

You have to allow for the fact that covid restrictions make it much harder for things like car retrieval and barrier repairs. I haven't noticed BTCC being any slower than any other series at it's level. Yes international series are a bit quicker at times but they generally have more marshals and more equipment.

Barrier repairs at circuits like Oulton Park may well take longer as well compared to a higher FIA graded circuit for similar reasons and the fact that there may well be more crash protection in place because of the potential for higher speed cars to be around. Having said that I've seen barrier repairs at GT events take hours.

As for the quality of the drivers thats all down to what money people have. At the end of the day everyone in the BTCC (to my knowledge) is paying to race one way or the other. If there were more people around with the money to race and who could do a better job than those in the seats then the teams would take them on but there aren't.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by WestHam92

Look at how Boardley has performed compared to Stephen Jelley in the same car with the same engine. Jelley is 12th with 43 points and Boardley is 22nd with six. He should be doing far better in a car as good as the 1 Series and his results lead me to believe that he isn't good enough for the championship.

Firstly - welcome to the forum.

You raise quite a few points in your post, some of which have been discussed at length previously with many arguments for and against your stance.
Some of them are perpetual topics of discussion in the forum and if you stick around, no doubt they'll be debated again.

At least you didn't talk about RWD/FWD or any comments regarding favouritism, so the really contentious points have been avoided for now.

I'd like to expand on the specific point I quote above. Particularly in reference to comparing two drivers who, from the outside, are in the same machinery. The following was said in interview over the weekend.

Boardley:
"We have base settings from WSR, but they are from a few years ago."
"Talking to a few of the other guys, it seems to have took them a little bit of time to adapt to the RWD NGTC car. I've not driven RWD NGTC before. I've got RWD experience, but it does turn out that NGTC RWD is different to other RWD cars"

Oliphant also commented that his setup is very different to Turkington's, and he is only just getting the results he feels he warrants."

So with HARD running the 1-Series for the first time, with limited data to compare with and not having someone of Turkington's ability in the team, do we really expect more from Boardley in his first season in RWD NGTC machinery?

The Parker/Jelley/1-series combination is in its 3rd season now, so they have a lot more development and experience under their belts. In their first season with that car, their best finish was a 14th, picking up just 4 points all season. Boardley already has more points after 9 races in the car. He also lies 3rd in the Jack Sears, with Crees at the top of the table.

I think there has to be an acceptance that in any form of motorsport, there has to be someone who is last. Those who are inexperienced and towards the back of the field are showing their potential with the results in the Jack Sears Trophy. Comparing Boardley's standing in that table with Hamilton and Brown shows how well he is doing compared to his team-mates, and others in competitive machinery.

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by WestHam92

My main complaint with it is how it can seem a bit amateurish at times. Take the incident with Carl Boardley on the formation lap of the first race at Oulton Park. Boardley makes a rather stupid mistake and crashes into the barriers at the final corner and it then takes over half an hour for the barriers to be repaired. For the record, I know how important marshals are to any motor racing event going ahead and I commend all of them for doing it. However, every time there's an incident in the BTCC that requires a car to be cleared away or barriers to be repaired, I expect there to be a lengthy delay.

As far as delays to barriers repairs, that's not something that is series specific - you would have seen the same delay regardless of who was racing. In this instance, one of the support posts needed re-seating or replacing. We aren't talking about the sort of post in your garden fence, these are closer in width to a telegraph pole, albeit with a square rather than round cross-section. Just lifting one of those into position is not the work of a moment, and those sort of barrier repairs are not something you can simply ignore. In reality it takes as long as it takes, and I wouldn't consider any of that operation as amateurish.

Whether we should consider driving into the barrier on the warm-up lap as 'a bit amateurish' is an entirely different argument.


As for suggestions that some driver are only there because they bring sponsorship - absolutely. This is not 20+ years ago where you had big budget manufacturer teams employing the best drivers they could afford. You bring money, you get a drive. That's how things have worked for many years, and not just in BTCC. Even at the so-called pinnacle of motorsport you have at least one drive who is there primarily because his father purchased the team.