Cooper T43

[henk4]

Based on the principles laid out in the first post on thread of the Cooper T41, here are some of the identified chassis of the T43, Mk2, 1957 model.
Doug Nye's list comprises 32 individual chassis, number 1-31 and one numbered F2-P-56, (could be a T41?) Cars number 30 and 31 were produced in December 1957 as the works cars for 1958.
So far we have positively identified # 5,6,7,23,24,27 and 28.
Nr.5 is a works car used for "school" purposes, fitted with an FWA engine
Nr.6 was sold to G. Wickens without an engine
Nr.7 is a Rob Walker car, FPF, delivered after number 22....
Nr.23 was supplied to Brian Naylor (FPF)
Nr.24 was supplied to Tommy Sopwith (FPF)
Nr.27 went to Joe Lubin (FPF)
and finally Nr 28 went to Mildren in Australia (FPF)

[henk4]

Here are number 28, and three for me as yet unknown cars (and hopefully all T43s). The car in Walker livery is owned by the Collier collection and was exhibited during the Cooper dedicated Monterey Historics of 2006.

The other two cars might be known to many in the British Classic Racing scene, so not having been able to identify them is purely my problem....

[jamesholland]

The pale blue car with the white stripes is supposedly ex Lance Reventlow

[David McKinney]

I’ve done my best with the T41s but the T43s are much harder to crack, bearing in mind (a) a lot more of them were built and (b) the comments made by Jeremy Hall, Allen Brown and Doug Nye

But I’ll see what I can do over the next few days.

[David McKinney]

Deep breath...

According to the factory/Nye chassis record:
F2-3-57 - works
F2-4-57 - school (FWA)
F2-5-57 - school (FWA)
F2-6-57 - Wicken
F2-7-57 - Rob Walker
F2-8-57 - works/Salvadori
F2-9-57 - works/Brabham
F2-10-57 - school (FWA)
F2-11-57 - Marsh
F2-12-57 - Rob Walker (2.0)
F2-13-57 - Nixon
F2-14-57 - Whitehouse
F2-15-57 - Reventlow (FWB)
F2-16-57 - Leston
F2-17-57 - Moore (FWB)
F2-18-57 - Thackwell (FWB)
F2-19-57 - Stoop (FWE)
F2-20-57 - Gibson
F2-21-57 - Gerard
F2-22-57 - Alan Brown
F2-23-57 - Naylor
F2-24-57 - Sopwith
F2-25-57 - Lewis
F2-26-57 - Atkins
F2-27-57 - Joe Lubin (USA)
F2-28-57 - Mildren (Australia)
F2-29-57 - Gibson
I am ignoring the dates cars were listed as these presumably refer to when they were invoiced rather than delivered

Also note that, as previously mentioned, F2-4-57 and/or F2-5-57 may have been T41s

As far as the works cars are concerned, it was reported during 1957 that, in addition to an F2 car each for Brabham and Salvadori, a third car was run - in conjunction with Rob Walker - with a stretched (1700cc) FPF engine in F1, with the Brabham and Salvadori taking turns. This was probably F2-8-57, though by the end of the year F2-9-57 also had a big engine.
Another big-engined 1957 car was Dick Gibson’s, though it did not race until 1958

Mike McDowell and Graham Hill also had drives in works F2 cars during the year, while Rob Walker drivers included Christie, Fairman and Brooks as well as Brabham.

[David McKinney]

Both works F1 cars raced in New Zealand in January 1958, F2-8-57 (1960cc) with Brabham and F2-9-57 (1700) with McLaren. Brabham’s car was sold to Merv Neil who raced it with 1700cc engine in NZ, Australia (once) and England (once) before replacing it with a T45. Its subsequent fate is unknown, though a car with this number appeared in the US in the 1980s, and was campaigned in European historic events from 1989 by Gerry Porter and others. check image forum
McLaren took his car to England but before the ship docked it had been sold to Steve Ouvaroff who raced it in 1958, after which it was sold via Ian Raby and appeared in a couple of mid-1959 British events in the hands of American Jim Haynes, and then with Peter Doyle in 1960. In 1964 Col. Mike Hunt won the Kuala Lumpur in what was described at the time as the ex-Ouvaroff car, and this may be the car which Peter Cowling had raced in southeast Asia previously.

The third 1957 works car, F2-3-57, does not appear again until perhaps the 1980s, when a car with that number was with various American collectors. At the time it was claimed to have been the car “raced by McLaren in Australia”, though McLaren never raced a T43 in Australia (or for that matter a T45 or T51). If the claim was intended to refer to McLaren in NZ, that was surely F2-9-57. Either way, this F2-3-57 returned to the UK in the 1990s and has raced regularly since then, most recently with Andrew Smith. check image forum

The car Brabham raced in the 1957 Oulton Park Gold Cup is recorded as being F2-27-57. This could be the car of that number subsequently sold to Joe Lubin, as his first US outing, with Bob Drake driving, does not seem to have taken place until November. However the number is also quoted for Ivor Bueb’s mount in the 1958 Aintree 200.

There is also evidence that the factory raced F2-4-57 and F2-5-57, listed as school cars, in 1957 F2 races. Brabham took the former to Australia in early 1958, possibly now renumbered F2-9-57, and raced it with 1960cc engine, before selling it (with 1700cc) engine. After appearing briefly in Bib Stillwell’s hands, it was campaigned for many years by Bill Patterson, but was crashed by John Brindley in 1963. The chassis and body were reportedly dumped and the other bits used for spares.
The subsequent fate of F2-5-57 is not known.

The fate of the other school cars is not known, though one of them might have gone to Patsy Burt (see below).

[David McKinney]

Mystery, too, surrounds the two Kiwi Stable cars of Moore and Thackwell. On the face of it, it seems that, although both supplied with FWB engines, they were eventually upgraded with FPFs and continued to race in Europe through 1958.
Thackwell took F2-18-57 home to NZ with him to race at the end of that year, and it was subsequently run by Lionel Bulcraig. The next owner, Duncan Mackenzie, was killed in his first race with the car in April 1961, after which it returned to Bulcraig who updated it with coil-sping suspension and ran in a few hillclimbs. He still owned the car in the late 1970s, then sold it to Ken Smith after which it passed to Brian Harker in Australia in 1981 and then to US ownership.
When the car returned to the UK for restoration it was given the number F2-14-57, based on the engine number. It was raced once or twice by Jan Heuten in the early 1990s before being sold at auction in 1997 to an earlier owner of the original F2-14-57.
When Thackwell’s car went to NZ at the end of 1958 parts for a complete T43 went with it. It was logical to presume this was the ex-Moore car, F2-17-57. It was built up by Syd Jensen with 1960cc engine and raced by David Evans from late 1960, then Neil Whittaker until early 1964. It then passed through various hands before being acquired by collector Bill Clark around 1970. He still had the car in 2002, identified now as F2-11-57, after which it returned to the UK and was raced by David Jeffries.
It is important to note that Clark’s reason for applying the number F2-11-57 to his car was his belief that the original Kiwi Stable car had been swapped for a complete FPF-engined T43, rather than merely acquiring its engine. The same could have happened with the other team car and F2-14-57.

[David McKinney]

F2-21-57 was not in fact a T43 at all, but Bob Gerard’s Cooper-BG-Bristol, designated T44 and raced with 2.2-litre Bristol engine. It was sold to southern Africa and apparently raced with Alfa Romeo engine by Eric Glasby in 1962. It was advertised in the UK in the late 1980s, then raced once or twice by John Harper before being sold to Glasby’s son in Australia.

[David McKinney]

Three T43s which appeared in 1958 remain unidentified (at least by me...) One was raced by Carroll Smith and another, at the Boxng Day Brands Hatch meeting, by Bill de Selncourt. Either or both could have been school cars.
The third was Patsy Burt’s hillclimb car, which she would continue to use until 1962. It was believed at the time to be the ex-school car F2-2-57, though it was later claimed to be F2-14-57. If it was the latter, the possibility of that car going to the Kiwi Equipe goes out the window.
After its retirement from the hills it spent many years in the National Motor Museum before being offered for sale, when still owned by Miss Burt, in 2000.

Ian Raby raced a T43 in 1959, and others were campaigned by George Wicken (F2-6-57?), Gilby Engineering (Keith Greene) and Gordon Jones. In addition George Keylock hillclimbed one, first with FPF engine and later a supercharged FWB, selling it in 1962 to Gordon Parker, who was still using it in 1966.
The works OSCA which raced in the US Grand Prix at the end of the year (with OSCA engine) was said to be T43-based, though may have been a copy.
Another T43 was said to have gone to South Africa the same year, and built up into a race car. This returned to the UK via Cameron Millar about 1970, then passed to Roger Sweet and was subsequently built up as a T51.

In 1960 the names of Paul Simpson, Richard Wrenn and Peter Westbury are linked to unidentified T43s. Simpson still had his in 1963, but Wrenn’s was a non-starter in what appears to have been its only race. (It was not the Hume-Cooper, with which Wrenn was also involved, and which had been constructed from a sports Cooper).
Westbury’s car was said to be ex-Naylor and Campbell-Jones, which would mean Hart could not have had F2-23-57 when we believe he did. Westbury used his car for hillclimbs, fitting a Daimler V8 in 1962. It was subsequently campaigned on the hills by Peter Hawtin and, from 1965, Martin Brain.

Other cars continue to crop up, albeit in decreasing numbers, throught the ’60s. Ray Fielding ran a superchared car in 1961 hillclimbs, and it was later used by Gray and Agnes Mickel. In February 1963 Fielding was advertising two ex-F2 T43s, one with an FWB engine and the other FPF-powered.
In Europe the names of Gino Munaro and “Wal Ever” both appear as drivers of T43s in 1961, the latter’s with OSCA power.

There were several other F2 Coopers racing in various parts of the world from 1958 on, some of which will surely have been T43s. Rather than add to an already confused picture, these are omitted from the above

[David McKinney]

Finally, it needs to be said that all the above is based on detailed reading of race reports, magazine articles, auction catalogues and books over the past 50 years, personal observation, and discussion with many owners and other players. It contains many unsupported (unsupportable?) claims and a good deal of supposition on my part, but is presented in the hope that it might engender discussion which will bring us closer to establishing a complete record
I haven’t been able to tie in your third or eighth photographs with specific cars, accepting that #3 seems not to be F2-7-57

[Alan Brown]

Advert in Autosport 26 February 1970

“F2 Cooper Climax 1475cc 1957 Works team car Ex Salvadori. Meticulously maintained. Consistent Winner Far East. Eastbourne 22577”

[David McKinney]

Thanks, Allen
I'm glad there's more than just two of us reading this
In 1970 I was still religiously noting ads from Autosport - must have missed that one
Looks like F2-9-57 coming home - wonder what happened to it after that?

[allenbrown]

Not me David, that's the other one!

[Bryan Miller]

I'm reading with vigour just unable to assist , Cooper cars have me totally mystified , I am hard put to tell the difference between most.

[ERault]

Very impressive work, David. Thank you for sharing it. Not much to add on my part, I am afraid, except more questions. I have not seen in your list for 1960 mystery cars Tom Threlfall (crashed at Siracusa) and Gerry Ashmore. But perhaps were they not T43s ?

[David McKinney]

My 'mystery cars' were ones I know to have been T43s
There are a number of others which could be T43s or T45s - including the two you mentioned

[fines]

Kudos, David!

I was always meaning to have a look at tackling the Cooper car histories - not that I was very keen on starting the project!

[rolanddavid]

Hello - just for info- ex works car roy salvadori chassis nr F2/8/57 is now located in vienna - greetings, rolanddavid@gmx.net

[henk4]

Update on F2-27-57
It is now being offered for sale as the Brabham Oulton Park winner (a possibility but not a certainty as David McK stated here in an earlier post).
When I saw the car at the Silverstone Classic in 2005, the history posted next to it, did not refer to Brabham, but just mentioned that it went to Lubin...and then ended up with Harvey Sykes. (don't know if he is the seller, or if it changed hands another time, before the current offer)

Surely a Brabham win will increase the value of a car greatly.

[BritishV8]

Here's another one...
F2/19/57 - Jay Nadelson's Cooper T43 Formula 2 Racecar (The article includes 44 photos.)



Jay Nadelson purchased F2/19/57 from Phil Bostwick, who was one of the five founding members of The Cooper Car Club.

[nols f]

Good day

I have just joined the forum. I live in South Africa. I am the current owner of chassis F2-5-57. We bought the car in 1978. It is totally origina - body, chassis, engine. It still has the school engine fitted as recorded in the chassis records. It also has the original chassis plate fitted to the floor board, not on the dash as one would expect. Attached are pictures of the car, the engine and copies of the original hand written chassis register I obtained from Doug Nye.

I will post a picture of the chassis plate soon.

Nols Fonternel

[allenbrown]

Welcome Nols. I would be very interested to know the history of your car up to 1978. Was it raced in South Africa?

[henk4]

Hi Nols, welcome, any current activities with the car?
I loved to read the FW/FP translations, "enkel nokas and dubbel nokas" ..

[nols f]

At the moment the car is dorment - in safe dry storage. I hope to build a bigger "toyroom" early next year which will allow space for all the cars. (I also have a few veteren & vintage cars in my collection).

The car was bought in England by a chap by the name of Micky Thomson in the mid sixties. He brought the car to Walfishbay in what is now Namibie and used the car for drag racing on the beach.

He sold the car to a guy in Welkom, South Africa whom I have not been able to trace. He in turn sold the car to Colin Venter in Bloemfontein from whom we bought it in totally original and complete condition. the car did however require to be restored.

[mikemaguire]

Hi Guys

I am new to this forum. I am part of a South African based restoration company in Cape Town and we have just been commissioned by the owner to restore his Cooper T43 . "F2/20/57
As this is a complete nut and bolt restoration I am looking for some advice to how some of the body parts fit. Would some-one be willing to assist me in this project.

Look forward to hearing from you soon.
Mike Maguire