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Old 22 Feb 2024, 13:29 (Ref:4197764)   #101
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Not seen on the RB20 during its unveiling, these vents appeared in Bahrain.
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 13:39 (Ref:4197768)   #102
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Not that I really doubt Adrian Newey, but it'll only be an advantage if it works. If it turns out to be his version of the Mercedes zeropod (looks good in theory but doesn't work so well in practice), then it'll be a disadvantage.
(Yesterdays testing times however do show my doubts to be unfounded!)
Agreed. (I did start the post with 'If' - it's very much on all that one word isn't it? )
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 13:41 (Ref:4197769)   #103
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Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith View Post
Not seen on the RB20 during its unveiling, these vents appeared in Bahrain.
Interesting - presumably that's where the air from those shoulder intakes comes out?

The other thing that photo highlights is just how bad the bare carbon fibre looks. Looks really tatty compared with the painted/wrapped portions of the bodywork.
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 13:50 (Ref:4197771)   #104
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Interesting - presumably that's where the air from those shoulder intakes comes out?

That's what I was thinking.
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 16:48 (Ref:4197800)   #105
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If that proves to be another big step forward for Red Bull then it's got the look of something that the other teams won't easily be able to copy. Presumably there's bits of that design baked into the tub itself so it's not 'just' a bodywork change for other teams to copy - they'd have to go for a whole new tub design. With the cost cap that's probably not an option so a nice season long advantage for Red Bull.
It is a big advantage for Red Bull to be working on this car with last years cap money. Maybe the title winning team should have to show up the next year with the same car as last year for the first half of the season. (saying this as a Red Bull fan)
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 17:33 (Ref:4197802)   #106
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Red Bull has air intakes above the drivers head. On Peter Windsor's stream, he said a Toro Rosso car from around 2017 had something similar. But I don't see it. Not on the 2017 car anyway
makes me curious about how old research and data is transferred between RB proper and TR/CashApp and if there is a price attached to any such transfers vis a vis the cap rules?

of course no such transfers may even be happening.
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Old 22 Feb 2024, 17:39 (Ref:4197803)   #107
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It is a big advantage for Red Bull to be working on this car with last years cap money. Maybe the title winning team should have to show up the next year with the same car as last year for the first half of the season. (saying this as a Red Bull fan)
Not totally sure what you are trying to say regarding "last years cap money". On one hand, all teams are both performing ongoing development of their current car plus designing the next car all within the same year (i.e. "last years cap money"). Now, the question is... how much is spent on developing the current car vs. next years car. If you are RBR in which you have a dominant car you can move funds and time that might normally be for the current car to the next car. Other teams are having to decide if they spend funds on the current car (maybe they are in risk of loosing a championship position), or maybe they have just given up on developing the current car and are just focusing on the next. Anyone can do this.

You call out a handicap for the winning car to use the prior year car. I am not sure about that, but there is an existing process that rewards success with a sliding scale with respect to time you can spend on aero development. For development in 2023 for 2024 seasons, the leading team would have been at 70% of baseline while the last place team would be at 115% of baseline. For second half of 2023 that was RBR at 70% with an additional drop that moved them down to 63% due to cost cap breech.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/a...bNRbdYx8a.html

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...d-ferrari-gain

Regardless, RBR was doing R&D from a position of powerful knowledge. They likely fully understood why their car worked well and could capitalize on that even with reduced R&D limits. While other teams were likely still figuring out how RBR was doing it (if they even fully have yet).

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Old 23 Feb 2024, 09:50 (Ref:4197891)   #108
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Unfortunately I think all teams are playing catch up. Red Bull hit out the park and have a higher starting point when it comes to designing and developing their car and also probably have a better understanding of what works and what does not. Some teams have changed concepts meaning they are playing catch up and going through a trial and error which Red Bull has mostly mastered it by the 3rd year

Red Bull should be applauded and deserve the success but again I say this, the cost cap and resource restrictions means that an advantage is easier to lock in. Other teams no longer have the potential to throw the kitchen sink at the car and catch up quickly. This is all good if all teams are around same performance bracket and this is true when you look at 2nd best - 4 teams are there or thereabouts, but almost impossible to catch red bull

And I am again skeptical of the 2026 rules reset. Yes it is a chance to catch up by the other teams but the engine changes are huge so I will not be surprised if another team develops a mega engine and we are back to what we had with Mercedes in 2014.
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Old 23 Feb 2024, 10:27 (Ref:4197895)   #109
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That's what I was thinking.

I think that it forms part of the extra cooling that Newey created because of his obsession, which is not necessarily a bad thing in this case, with tight packaging of the engine. There has been comment in the media that overheating was the major concern that Red Bull had coming in to the season, but, so far, this doesn't seem to have happened.
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Old 23 Feb 2024, 14:23 (Ref:4197930)   #110
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I think that it forms part of the extra cooling that Newey created because of his obsession, which is not necessarily a bad thing in this case, with tight packaging of the engine. There has been comment in the media that overheating was the major concern that Red Bull had coming in to the season, but, so far, this doesn't seem to have happened.
I think I read speculation somewhere that RBR is going to have two specs of this car. And the different will be around track specific cooling requirements. I think one car with smaller inlets when ambient temps will be lower and one with larger inlets when ambient temps will be higher.

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Old 23 Feb 2024, 16:43 (Ref:4197949)   #111
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I think I read speculation somewhere that RBR is going to have two specs of this car. And the different will be around track specific cooling requirements. I think one car with smaller inlets when ambient temps will be lower and one with larger inlets when ambient temps will be higher.
Yes - there was an article from Autosport that was pretty definite about that - smaller inlets expected after the first few (warm) race locations.

It's pretty typical Newey I think - his attention to detail and to improving everything, regardless of how small the item or the improvement, has been a hallmark for many years.
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Old 23 Feb 2024, 17:10 (Ref:4197953)   #112
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classic Alonso telling it like it is.

'ALONSO: 19 DRIVERS ALREADY KNOW THEY WON'T WIN 2024 F1 TITLE'

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/a...itle/10579100/

a tad clickbaitey headline but hard to argue against!
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Old 23 Feb 2024, 18:03 (Ref:4197957)   #113
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Shall we do all of the DOTR polls now to get them out of the way nice and early.....?
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 02:46 (Ref:4198271)   #114
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classic Alonso telling it like it is.

'ALONSO: 19 DRIVERS ALREADY KNOW THEY WON'T WIN 2024 F1 TITLE'

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/a...itle/10579100/

a tad clickbaitey headline but hard to argue against!
In the Mercedes domination years, the whole field would get lapped except 2 cars. It won't be nearly that bad.

Max is overdue for some bad luck. He collided with Russell in the Vegas race and still won. He could have easily got a puncture. It won't be as easy for him this time around.
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 03:48 (Ref:4198275)   #115
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In the Mercedes domination years, the whole field would get lapped except 2 cars. It won't be nearly that bad.
Interestingly, during the 'Mercedes domination' years of 2014-20, the whole field got lapped except two cars .... zero times.

The closest were three cars finishing on the lead lap, this happened three times in this era:

- 2017 Spanish GP, won by Hamilton, from Vettel (Ferrari) and Verstappen (Red Bull)

- 2018 Austrian GP won by Verstappen (Red Bull), from the two Ferraris of Vettel and Raikkonen

- 2020 Spanish GP won by Hamilton, ahead of Vettel (Ferrari) and Bottas.
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 19:24 (Ref:4198391)   #116
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Shall we do all of the DOTR polls now to get them out of the way nice and early.....?
I vote for Kimi.
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 20:42 (Ref:4198406)   #117
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It’s ok, I will do my usual job of trying to pick a different driver for each race whenever possible
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 20:49 (Ref:4198408)   #118
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Shall we do all of the DOTR polls now to get them out of the way nice and early.....?
For me DOTR is never automatically the race winner. So a potential Max 2024 romp doesn't worry me from that perspective.

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Old 26 Feb 2024, 22:12 (Ref:4198418)   #119
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I vote for Kimi.
Noted Pete......
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Old 26 Feb 2024, 22:49 (Ref:4198420)   #120
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I vote for Kimi.
I think that we all should leave him alone - he knows what he's doing.
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