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Old 24 Feb 2010, 19:28 (Ref:2639948)   #1
Teretonga
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The Real Reason for the decline in Indycar racing?

Theres a a good article by Anthony Schoettle in the Indianapolis Business Journal (Feb 23rd) re tobacco money and sponsorship revenues for open wheel.

10 years ago the sponsorship money coming into Indycar was $60 million a year ($635 million) more than Nascar ($575 million).....
Now is a dribble compared with that amount....

If you can't support the teams then racing will dry up...
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Old 24 Feb 2010, 21:18 (Ref:2640034)   #2
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mountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Don't get me started.
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Old 24 Feb 2010, 22:12 (Ref:2640066)   #3
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Where's indycool these days?
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Old 24 Feb 2010, 22:42 (Ref:2640080)   #4
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Where's indycool these days?
Dunno he bizarrely disappeared from here practically the day Champcar closed up shop.

It's a mystery as to why.

JohnSSC vanished as well.
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Old 24 Feb 2010, 23:17 (Ref:2640100)   #5
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Don't get me started.
Don't worry we all know your sentiments and I am 100% in your camp!
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Old 24 Feb 2010, 23:24 (Ref:2640104)   #6
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Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
Theres a a good article by Anthony Schoettle in the Indianapolis Business Journal (Feb 23rd) re tobacco money and sponsorship revenues for open wheel.

10 years ago the sponsorship money coming into Indycar was $60 million a year ($635 million) more than Nascar ($575 million).....
Now is a dribble compared with that amount....

If you can't support the teams then racing will dry up...


If that's the real reason, why aren't F1 and NASCAR also a pale shadow of their former selves?
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 00:30 (Ref:2640113)   #7
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The "Law of Diminishing Returns".
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 03:22 (Ref:2640132)   #8
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I talk about this every month, hell, me and my friend just talked about it today.
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 06:15 (Ref:2640156)   #9
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If that's the real reason, why aren't F1 and NASCAR also a pale shadow of their former selves?
Read the article.
It gives the sponsorship revenues for both CART, IRL and NASCAR in general and how each organisation tackled the loss of tobabcco money. It's the way the respective organiations organised themselves and their repective series, who they targeted for commercial support and what the consequences were for each of them.
It makes sense and has some very good points the IRL could learn from. Whatever the past, you need to learn the lessons from past events if you are going to be successful in the future. Open wheel in the US has a big mountain to climb but Everest is big and people climb that every year .simply for the challenge.
Open wheel has a future if the right decisions are made but you will not reurn to the haylacon days of the 80's/90's overnight.

Secondly its not about blame. Its about learning what not to do and not repeating mistakes, neither your own past mistakes nor anyone elses.
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 07:22 (Ref:2640181)   #10
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 16:52 (Ref:2640454)   #11
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The real reason Indycar is declining is because nobody is watching it..

That being said I one of the 100,000 or so people that still do tune in each race. I really enjoy going to the race in St. Pete as well but I go mainly just to see the ALMS run but I still watch the Indycar race.

Last edited by cthib10; 25 Feb 2010 at 17:03.
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 17:39 (Ref:2640476)   #12
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Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
Read the article.
It gives the sponsorship revenues for both CART, IRL and NASCAR in general and how each organisation tackled the loss of tobabcco money. It's the way the respective organiations organised themselves and their repective series, who they targeted for commercial support and what the consequences were for each of them.
It makes sense and has some very good points the IRL could learn from. Whatever the past, you need to learn the lessons from past events if you are going to be successful in the future. Open wheel in the US has a big mountain to climb but Everest is big and people climb that every year .simply for the challenge.
Open wheel has a future if the right decisions are made but you will not reurn to the haylacon days of the 80's/90's overnight.

Secondly its not about blame. Its about learning what not to do and not repeating mistakes, neither your own past mistakes nor anyone elses.
I don't think it was loss of tobacco or any other segment of sponsors that was the main cause. That was merely an effect of other things that happened.

For your average fan, sponsors and all involved, people want to be where the hip and cool action is. The split spilled a vat full of negativity over the whole sport and year by year people and sponsors left for pastures anew. tony george had to have total absolute control at all costs and no one out there either wanted that or wanted to be a part of that.

I remember in business school we learned about the downward business spiral. As business goes down, you pare off this and that to survive and eventually you are in a hole and not likely to get out because you have lost so much ground. Indycar is in the bottom of the toilet and I don't know if it can make it out. Too much damage has been done.

I am someone that believes in blame. Without knowing who and what is at fault you cannot learn for the future.
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 18:17 (Ref:2640506)   #13
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I am sure one of the main problems Indy has is that you struggle to watch it in the US. I usually watch the races on Sky in the UK with no problem but often struggle to find them when i am in the US. If as a casual viewer you can't easily find it, your not going to watch it. Better TV coverage equals more sponsors etc.
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Old 25 Feb 2010, 18:56 (Ref:2640526)   #14
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I can totally imagine how US fans face trying to watch this series. Today NASCAR announced a deal with openaccess3 on 190 on sky in the middle of no where with all the other small channels. NASCAR is unknown here as it is to a degree so how will he casual find it? It's like trying to find a needle in a haystack so I can imagine why Versus with IRL get 0.1 etc when on ABC they got 1.0-1.5 etc.....

To gain any more ground they need to be back on a top tv channel. They would have to be buy it but they won't so...That's one of the main problems because drivers especially PT for example can't get any funding for the none ABC/ESPN races..
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Old 26 Feb 2010, 02:23 (Ref:2640678)   #15
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Originally Posted by Teretonga View Post
Read the article.
It gives the sponsorship revenues for both CART, IRL and NASCAR in general and how each organisation tackled the loss of tobabcco money. It's the way the respective organiations organised themselves and their repective series, who they targeted for commercial support and what the consequences were for each of them.
It makes sense and has some very good points the IRL could learn from. Whatever the past, you need to learn the lessons from past events if you are going to be successful in the future. Open wheel in the US has a big mountain to climb but Everest is big and people climb that every year .simply for the challenge.
Open wheel has a future if the right decisions are made but you will not reurn to the haylacon days of the 80's/90's overnight.

Secondly its not about blame. Its about learning what not to do and not repeating mistakes, neither your own past mistakes nor anyone elses.
I don't see a link anywhere.

If it's trying to make the case the IRL was uniquely dependent on tobacco money, so the loss of tobacco money forced decline, that's a pretty tough argument to make. Remember the Winston Cup? It became the Nextel Cup and now the Sprint Cup, and it is now a much bigger deal than it was in the tobacco days. Remember McLaren's sponsor during the great Senna/Prost battles? Those cars became Silver Arrows and continued to be quite competitive. If the IRL was uniquely dependent of tobacco and CART by comparison wasn't, why did K-Mart, Texaco, Shell, Valvoline, Miller, Bud, and all the other household name sponsors leave CART?

The Split. The Split is the only reason American open wheel went down the tube while other motorsports flourished.

So, as far as learning from past mistakes, what is there to learn?

I think what there is to learn is that the sport was at its best when it was run by the people with gasoline running in their veins. There were legions of fans like myself who in the mid to late '80's switched loyalty from F1 to CART as their favorite open wheel series because it was a series they could afford to watch in person from one to several times a year, and could walk the paddock and see cars not much slower than F1 cars up close and personal.

Then, somebody had to strangle the golden goose, so we are back to F1 fans, watching from afar.

The only hope for the future would be the people with gasoline in their veins taking the sport back. Something I hope the Delta Wing group does.

If that happens, I have absolutely no doubt the sport will climb out of the pit it's in. Of course if that happens, the argument will be it was because the economy improved, so that was going to happen anyway (conveniently ignoring the decline of the sport during the go-go mid '00's).
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