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Old 31 Jul 2001, 10:14 (Ref:124233)   #1
f1manoz
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f1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridf1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridf1manoz should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Article on Button's steady decline

http://www.crosswinds.net/~f1rejects...ton/index.html

After you've read this, have a good think to yourself and then you will understand why I think he's over-rated, and why JPM IS the better driver, in more ways than on.

The article proves many things:
a. Williams were correct in dumping Button
b. Button is just a 'celebrity'
c. Montoya is better
d. Button should not be allowed back to Williams
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:08 (Ref:124256)   #2
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You've reminded me.

When I looked Button was in front of Fissi and then after the stops he was behind? Can anyone shed some light on that for me please?

Perhaps I should also just mention how objective and unbiased that piece of journalism is.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:12 (Ref:124260)   #3
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This is a well researched and incisive piece of writing and the author spent nearly a week researching it - and everything in it can be substantiated by consulting Autosport magazines from January 2000 to the present.

The photos were chosen by the website but are absolutely perfect for the article though. Most especially the picture of the girlfriend Button dumped vs. the supermodel he is currently "auditioning".
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:16 (Ref:124263)   #4
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I'm not a button fan but I'm sorry but that article proves nothing. It's written by someone who states her research was all based on Autosport (a BRITISH media publication). Of course they're going to go ga-ga over Button, he is one of their's afterall. That article is based on one person's interpretation of hearsay, with absolutely no facts to back it up. That's not even jounalism it's just gossip.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:23 (Ref:124268)   #5
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Perhaps I should also just mention how objective and unbiased that piece of journalism is.

And could somebody answer my question please?
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:32 (Ref:124275)   #6
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I thought that was very well thought out, very well researched and well written. Okay, it took a very anti-Button stance from the outset, but you have to question his behaviour and where his priorities lie. Quite insightful I thought.

Last edited by angst; 31 Jul 2001 at 11:32.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:33 (Ref:124276)   #7
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It wasn't written to prove anything. It is an opinion piece and is submitted as one.

Lighten up, for heaven's sake.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:42 (Ref:124278)   #8
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Could somebody answer my question please?

Or wasn't anybody watching the Benettons until they were in the top six?

Perhaps I should also just mention how objective well written and unbiased that piece of journalism is.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:45 (Ref:124283)   #9
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1) Nobody watches the Benettons except Button's father and Fisi's wife.

2) Pete, you are becoming extremely tedious. Don't you have another string to your harp?
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:47 (Ref:124284)   #10
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In response to Peter Mallett's question, Fisichella stopped on lap 26 while Button stopped on lap 24, Fisichella's stop was also 2.4 seconds quicker, I guess that was enough to put him in front.

Giancarlo Fisichella (fourth): "I am very happy, for Jenson and myself. I made a good first start, but didn't get away so well the second time because the drivers ahead closed the door and I lost a few places. I drove conservatively in the early stages and saved enough fuel to do a slightly longer first stint than planned. When I rejoined I was ahead of Jenson and things continued to go well, although I ran slightly wide near the end and lost a bit of time. The whole result is great for the team, and I would like to thank everyone who has helped make it possible, and a special thanks to Michelin, whose tires were excellent in every respect."

As for the article proving something, my response was to the thread topic and it's statement that the article proved "many things", which it clearly doesn't. And I still think that the article is garbage.

Last edited by enemy-ace; 31 Jul 2001 at 11:49.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 11:57 (Ref:124287)   #11
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Originally posted by enemy-ace
In response to Peter Mallett's question, Fisichella stopped on lap 26 while Button stopped on lap 24, Fisichella's stop was also 2.4 seconds quicker, I guess that was enough to put him in front.

Giancarlo Fisichella (fourth): "I am very happy, for Jenson and myself. I made a good first start, but didn't get away so well the second time because the drivers ahead closed the door and I lost a few places. I drove conservatively in the early stages and saved enough fuel to do a slightly longer first stint than planned. When I rejoined I was ahead of Jenson and things continued to go well, although I ran slightly wide near the end and lost a bit of time. The whole result is great for the team, and I would like to thank everyone who has helped make it possible, and a special thanks to Michelin, whose tires were excellent in every respect."
Thank you Mr Ace and well done to both Benetton drivers for sensibly keeping it all together.

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Originally posted by enemy-ace
As for the article proving something, my response was to the thread topic and it's statement that the article proved "many things", which it clearly doesn't. And I still think that the article is garbage.
Well, I think it is possibly the most objective, unbiased, no I don't. I think its possibly the worst piece of bile I've ever seen.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 12:00 (Ref:124289)   #12
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well played liz

and having done the same with my collection of autosports for a projected article a bit ago, i can only say you did a cracking job.

now, if only we could get autosport to take a slightly less pro-jenson line..
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 12:14 (Ref:124294)   #13
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Wha?

Y'mean Liz wrote it?

I hope not because I always had a bit more faith in her than that.

A piece of advice. Don't go using Autosport as a sole source of info. If its recent get the race reps from the clubs and compare them with the mag. If its about a driver, at least talk to him/her and get some balance. If its older, then go to the library and read the books. But to use a comic and pass the results off as serious factual journalism is a little bit er..... B'sides I'd be seriously agrieved if I was the editor of Autosport and I got no financial reward for the plagiarism.

Always remember Autosport needs to sell copy and they'll do anything to do so. The bits used in the subject of this thread were lifted out of context. Button wasn't interviewed and had no chance to comment on the content.

Example (I paraphrase) His Father and his Manager "bagging" JPM at every opportunity.

Does that equate to Button "bagging" JPM? Don't think so. Do we know if he sanctions these actions? Nope we don't.

You see what I mean?
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 12:59 (Ref:124315)   #14
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An interesting article, and one which does not pretend to be something it isn't. It is an unashamed Button-bash. But rather than it being aimed at the boy Bunsen himself, perhaps it should look at what caused all this.

Jenson's trouble is, the media built him up to be Britain's next F1 superstar before he'd even got in the car, and possibly silly old Jenson began to believe the hype surrounding him. No-one gave him a chance to prove himself - all we got from Jim and the idiots at ITV was how wonderful Jenson was, and every week Autosprout had some new rubbish to print about him.

I despised the boy when he started at Williams, simply because of the attention he received. It was undeserved. But by the end of the season I held a great deal of respect for the guy - on the track. He is a very talented F1 driver, who unfortunately has landed a seat driving the worst car on the grid. It is underpowered, turns like a brick (if at all), and does not suit his style.

Now the success has gone, and the media knives are out. What a surprise.

Granted, his flat and yacht-buying antics do nothing to help his credibility, and he should indeed spend more time looking at how he can get some more results before the season is out. But at the same time everyone is giving the guy a tough time for no reason.

Don't blame Jenson for his behaviour - he had a media role to fulfil and unfortunately for him, he fell into the trap of doing it.

I cannot quite believe I have written this much about Jenson Button. And granted it's a load of b*ll*cks I'm sure. But that's my thoughts on the subject.

Last edited by Minardi fan; 31 Jul 2001 at 13:00.
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Old 31 Jul 2001, 13:32 (Ref:124334)   #15
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Well, Pete, the truth of the matter is, the article was specifically designed to reflect what was said in Autosport and no other magazine, for the very reason that nobody else in any other country gives a rip about Bunsen, and the Brits (as MFan points out) thought he was the Second Coming of Somebody Who Used To Make Us Proud [fill in your British hero here]. And it is an article that was solicited for "F1 Rejects", not "The Jensen Button Love In" or something, and their articles take a certain point of view and a certain tone of voice. Had it been for Autosport or some other "serious" magazine then I would have used other sources and made it quite different in tone.

And if an article makes some of the people furious and some people happy and the rest find something in it to think and/or talk about, then it is a success.

However, I doubt I will ever be invited to audition for the position of Jenson's Girlfriend du jour, nor will I be welcome on his yacht.

Oh deary dear.
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