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19 Jun 2007, 09:02 (Ref:1941442) | #1 | ||
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More about fastest laps
More info about fast laptimes in Indy. In this thread I'm going to put a sort of "average fast lap" for every driver (who did some laps!). It is the average of the 25% fastest laps they did (i.e. in this case, the 18 fastest laps they did in the race).
Pure fastest lap is interesting as a measure of raw pace a driver is able to extract from his car in the best conditions. But it is a little bit "flukey" as sometimes it is not consistent with the 2nd , 3rd,... fastest lap he did. I particular, KR's fastest lap was better than LH's, but looking the 2nd, 3rd, etc fastest laps shows LH was usually faster than KR even in top laps. Everyone who has tried a F1 sim knows sometimes one does a fluke time Another reason to do this stat is... I like to do calculations Well, here it goes: Code:
DRV TEAM GAP NL ----------------- HAM MCL 0.00 73 RAI FER 0.03 73 ALO MCL 0.08 73 MAS FER 0.20 73 HEI BMW 0.46 55 KOV REN 0.62 73 VET BMW 0.82 73 WEB RBL 0.83 73 TRU TOY 0.93 73 ROS WIL 1.03 68 FIS REN 1.07 72 DAV SAG 1.11 72 WUR WIL 1.61 72 SUT SPY 1.72 71 BUT HON 1.83 72 SPE STR 2.06 71 LIU STR 2.27 68 ALB SPY 2.83 70 SAT SAG _ 13 Team mates gaps were: Code:
HAM-ALO 0.08 RAI-MAS 0.17 HEI-VET 0.36 KOV-FIS 0.45 WEB-COU ---- TRU-SCH ---- ROS-WUR 0.58 DAV-SAT ---- SUT-ALB 1.11 BUT-BAR ---- SPE-LIU 0.21 Code:
GP FA/LH FM/KR ---------------- AUS 0.08 -0.94 MAL 0.47 -0.30 BAH -0.20 0.10 SPA 0.09 Inft* MON 0.11 0.76 CAN -0.58* 0.10 USA -0.08 -0.17 ---------------- Avg 0.00 0.10 The average gap is done discounting the anomalies (normal procedure to get a robust estimation). The average gap is negligible in FA-LH and very small in FM-KR. I have to say this average is slightly incorrect as I would have to compensate the difference in lap length among the circuits (laziness ). But, anyway, the results are surely very approximate. Alonso and Massa "wins" 4-3 to his team mates in this kind of fast laps, so of course things are very equilibrate. |
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19 Jun 2007, 09:08 (Ref:1941448) | #2 | |||
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Ah, lovely. I have often thought about this, and implied related things, but been too lazy to sit down and work it through (would've in my past).
It is clearly better to look at a larger base than one lap. I will now read and reflect the data. As I posted in another thread earlier today: Quote:
Last edited by Dutton; 19 Jun 2007 at 09:15. |
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19 Jun 2007, 09:10 (Ref:1941450) | #3 | ||
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Thanks, mate!
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19 Jun 2007, 21:11 (Ref:1942069) | #4 | ||
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The stand out statistic on that was how much Albers sucks :P Or at the very least, how much better Sutil is.
On a side note; how come you counted Alonso's Canadian performance as anomolous? Because of the safety car interfering? Because in size alone, it doesn't seem anomolous. |
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20 Jun 2007, 06:20 (Ref:1942259) | #5 | ||
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Interesting analysis Schummy, thanks for putting the data up.
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20 Jun 2007, 10:17 (Ref:1942386) | #6 | |||
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To calculate the average without anomalous values, in an unbiased way, anomalous are dropped but also the "opposite" values are dropped. In case of FA/LH, -0.58 is dropped (the smallest value), but +0.47 is dropped as well (the greatest value). |
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20 Jun 2007, 17:05 (Ref:1942692) | #7 | ||
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have I told you before you're a sick man Schummy?? .. yeah . I think I did
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Apocalypse becomes creation / Gor-Gor shall erase the nation Before you leap into his gizzard / Fall and worship Tyrant lizard Ciao Marco |
20 Jun 2007, 22:28 (Ref:1942971) | #8 | ||
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Dani, the last time you said it to me was last week when we were playing roulettes in Las Vegas
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21 Jun 2007, 06:53 (Ref:1943099) | #9 | ||
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More data.
Firstly, the six best drivers in this particular "fast laps" stat in each GP so far: Code:
RAI 0.00 58 ALO 0.13 58 HAM 0.21 58 KUB 0.55 36 MAS 0.94 58 HEI 1.13 58 ALO 0.00 56 RAI 0.46 56 HAM 0.47 56 MAS 0.76 56 HEI 0.79 56 ROS 0.89 42 HAM 0.00 57 MAS 0.09 57 RAI 0.19 57 ALO 0.20 57 HEI 0.23 57 KUB 0.70 57 MAS 0.00 65 ALO 0.20 65 HAM 0.31 65 KOV 0.39 65 RAI 0.54 9 KUB 0.60 65 ALO 0.00 78 HAM 0.11 78 MAS 0.73 78 KUB 0.99 77 FIS 1.20 77 BUT 1.46 77 HAM 0.00 70 HEI 0.35 70 ALO 0.58 70 MAS 0.80 51 ROS 0.84 70 KUB 0.97 26 HAM 0.00 73 RAI 0.03 73 ALO 0.08 73 MAS 0.20 73 HEI 0.39 55 KOV 0.62 73 Secondly, I have done a sort of WDC classification table counting those average best laps instead of race results. So we get something like a WDC classification in terms of race pace. I'm fond of the "classic" scoring system 9-6-4-3-2-1, so I have used it in this calculation: Code:
A M B S M C U HAM 4 4 9 4 6 9 9 = 45 ALO 6 9 3 6 9 4 4 = 41 MAS 2 3 6 9 4 3 3 = 30 RAI 9 6 4 2 0 0 6 = 27 HEI 1 2 2 0 0 6 2 = 13 KUB 3 0 1 1 3 1 0 = 9 KOV 0 0 0 3 0 0 1 = 4 ROS 0 1 0 0 0 2 0 = 3 FIS 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 = 2 BUT 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 = 1 Thirdly, team mates comparisons. Here some minor differences can be seen respect the first post (because of the change of method). Code:
ALO-HAM 0.01 MAS-RAI 0.02 HEI-KUB 0.36 FIS-KOV 0.16 ROS-WUR 0.75 WEB-COU -0.28 TRU-RSC 0.26 BUT-BAR -0.17 SAT-DAV 0.12 LIU-SPE 0.46 SUT-ALB 0.33 Well, ok, I'm going again into my tomb because the Moon is rising quickly. |
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21 Jun 2007, 16:26 (Ref:1943489) | #10 | ||
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That last stat is fairly interesting, because in absolute fastest lap times Rosberg and Wurz are fairly close together. I guess Wurz just can't run them together.
Also, what's with the huge change in gap between for initial set of data and this one with respect to Sutil vs Albers? Is that just because Albers crashes out the whole time? |
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21 Jun 2007, 16:28 (Ref:1943491) | #11 | |||
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Quote:
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21 Jun 2007, 18:47 (Ref:1943580) | #12 | |||
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Quote:
I'll try to post details about Rosberg-Wurz and Sutil-Albers, along the 7 GPs, a bit later. So we could see how it has behaved. |
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21 Jun 2007, 23:31 (Ref:1943796) | #13 | |||
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Quote:
Great work though, even if it does confuse the hell out of me at times |
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That's so frickin uncool man! |
22 Jun 2007, 08:17 (Ref:1943987) | #14 | ||
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Well, I'm confused everyday
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23 Jun 2007, 07:36 (Ref:1944773) | #15 | ||
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As promised , here are the differences along the 7 GPs between those two pairs. "Infty" means the second mentioned driver cannot do a minimum of valid laps. "-Infty" means the same for the first mentioned driver.
ROS-WUR: 1.04 0.37 0.41 Infty -0.02 1.33 0.60 SUT-ALB: 1.60 -Infty 0.61 0.14 -0.20 0.04 1.08 Very clear advantage for Rosberg, as the only GP where Wurz was faster than him was Monaco with just a negligible 0"02 gap. Albers has "beaten" Sutil two times (MAL and MON), but in Malaysia Sutil didn't do enough laps. In Monaco the gap was small. Sutil has been faster 5 times, with two big gaps, one pretty biggy and two very small. In short there were three races with similar pace and three races with a very clear aadvantage for Sutil. |
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4 Jul 2007, 14:34 (Ref:1954279) | #16 | ||
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Data about that statistic (average of the 25% best laps) in GP FRANCE. Expressed as gaps respect the best driver.
Code:
GP FRANCE DRV GAP LAPS -------------- MAS 0.00 70 RAI 0.02 70 HAM 0.35 70 FIS 0.64 70 HEI 0.66 70 ALO 0.69 70 BUT 0.73 70 RSC 0.74 69 KUB 0.86 70 ROS 0.95 70 KOV 1.04 69 BAR 1.35 69 WEB 1.35 69 WUR 1.40 69 COU 1.45 69 SPE 1.72 55 SAT 1.91 68 SUT 2.06 68 ALB 2.75 28 DAV _ 1 TRU _ 1 -------------- Code:
A M B S M C U F HAM 4 4 9 4 6 9 9 4 = 49 ALO 6 9 3 6 9 4 4 1 = 42 MAS 2 3 6 9 4 3 3 9 = 39 RAI 9 6 4 2 0 0 6 6 = 33 HEI 1 2 2 0 0 6 2 2 = 15 KUB 3 0 1 1 3 1 0 0 = 9 FIS 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 3 = 5 KOV 0 0 0 3 0 0 1 0 = 4 ROS 0 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 = 3 BUT 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 = 1 Code:
Tmates GAP VOL =================== ALO-HAM -0.05 0.16 RAI-MAS -0.02 0.30 HEI-KUB 0.20 0.43 FIS-KOV 0.19 0.32 ROS-WUR 0.70 0.34 WEB-COU -0.21 0.69 TRU-RSC -0.10 1.07 BUT-BAR -0.05 0.58 SPE-LIU -0.36 0.52 SAT-DAV 0.30 0.60 SUT-ALB 0.39 0.45 ===================
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4 Jul 2007, 14:41 (Ref:1954283) | #17 | ||
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Matrix meaning how many times a driver has been faster than other:
Code:
HAM ALO MAS RAI HAM --- 4-4 6-2 5-3 ALO 4-4 --- 5-3 4-4 MAS 2-6 3-5 --- 5-3 RAI 3-5 4-4 3-5 --- |
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4 Jul 2007, 17:35 (Ref:1954403) | #18 | ||
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In this graph appear the laptimes of Hamilton (black, no pun intended) and Alonso (red, no pun neither) during GP FRANCE. At the left the fastest lap, then the second fastest lap, the third fastest lap, etc. At the right the slowest laps (except anomalous laps: first lap, in and out laps,...)
GP France, Hamilton-Alonso Interestingly, only in his fastest lap Alonso is better than Hamilton. In the rest of laps Lewis is faster than Fernando. The gap is big: most of time is 0.5 secs or bigger. The datum about absolute fastest race lap is deceiving (or perhaps not, see below). Only the best two or three FA's laps are comparable to LH's good laps. This has two sides:
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4 Jul 2007, 18:25 (Ref:1954433) | #19 | ||
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Now a graph (histogram-like) showing the (smoothed) frequency of lap times of Raikkonen (green), Massa (red) and Hamilton (black) in Magny-Cours. The first laps, and the in and out laps have been dropped in each case (two piststops for Ferraris, three for Hamilton), because they don't represent any significant lap time..
Comparison between KR, FM and LH
Last edited by Schummy; 4 Jul 2007 at 18:31. |
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5 Jul 2007, 00:37 (Ref:1954752) | #20 | ||
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Nice work.
Maybe its obvious, but I would say Hamiltons bell-curve is caused by an additional pit stop, so he never had as much fuel on board as the Ferraris or as big a variance in tyre wear. |
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5 Jul 2007, 04:58 (Ref:1954813) | #21 | ||
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In fact the LH's stints 2 and 3 were very "narrows" in terms of lap time variations (in particular stint 2 was relatively "longish"). Stints 1 and 4 were more "normal", "wider" set of laps.
Interestingly, this season, lap times during a stint don't always follows a clear pattern according to the decreasing fuel weight. Tyre wear plays a role and sometimes lap times are pretty stable, sometimes the best laps are the first ones and the last ones, and sometimes the last laps are the best. Certainly with less fuel in pitstop the overall speed is faster along those patterns in the stint, but it is not being the major factor in homogeneity of laps. |
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