Habberfield .....a nut - Page 4

corkholio · 26 Feb 2003, 17:25 (Ref:518473)

It's not slightly if Monteiro had to slam on the brakes to avoid launching over Blcokerfeld's car and into the trees.

Dov · 26 Feb 2003, 20:16 (Ref:518632)

This Blockerfeld topic just won't go away. But with a month in between races, what the hell are we supposed to talk about.

The Snout · 27 Feb 2003, 01:03 (Ref:518820)

Haberfeld's great. Wreckless, pushing all over the track. Great stuff. A bit of character and bluff driving, just the sort of psychotic B*ullsh1t Champcar needed to kick off the season. I can't wait to see him on ovals.

Jordi · 27 Feb 2003, 18:10 (Ref:519492)

corkholio, maybe Monteiro had to slam on the brakes, but if he hadn't there wouldn't have been funeral arrangements for him, as you said before in the topic. That's not at all true.

corkholio · 27 Feb 2003, 19:43 (Ref:519608)

Quote:

Originally posted by Jordi
corkholio, maybe Monteiro had to slam on the brakes, but if he hadn't there wouldn't have been funeral arrangements for him, as you said before in the topic. That's not at all true.

I said they could be, and it was certainly not impossible for Monteiro to launch over Blockerfeld's car had he not slowed down. It is certainly not impossible for a car to get launched into the air ala Krosnoff(RIP)-Johansson 96 and as a Servia fan you should remember Laguna Seca 01.

Jordi · 27 Feb 2003, 22:09 (Ref:519745)

Toronto 96 has been mentioned, but even though it is not impossible for it to happen again, God forbid, I don't think that means that Haberfeld must be called the name you're giving him constantly (which personally, I don't like it at all -would you like to be called any names?) or be black flagged. I mean, it was not that bad, from my point of view.

And I do remember Oriol at Laguna Seca. But nothing happened at St. Petersburg. I just believe the members here are being overzealous... There's always risk in racing. And while Haberfeld blocked Monteiro one moment, Bourdais blocked Fernandez for 3 corners with a damaged car. Sure it was at slower speeds, but I think there's too much talk of Haberfeld and too less of Bourdais. I think Fernandez has more reason than Monteiro to be upset, if Tiago is upset at all.

djb · 28 Feb 2003, 03:15 (Ref:520053)

I have to agree about Fernandez, as I felt it was very unsporting of Bourdais to keep getting in front of him at the apexs-he must have been thinking he ccould get back out and was refusing to give anyone even a few seconds advantage.

As for the initial gripe about Haberfeld-going from memory and the replays, I didn't think that he was that out of line, as he seemed to have moved over and then held his line, and not getting that close to the wall. I did however, just peek a look at the CART multi-media site thingee and can see now that the more iffy part of the move was right after coming out of the previous corner onto the straight, where he moved over on Junqueira the entire width of the track. It may have been one move, I agree, but it was a hell of a wide one! Looking at this again, I'd have to say that it was more towards blocking, as Junq had a run on him, he obviously didn't want to back off and lose his momentum, and Haber kept on moving him over and over and over. I'd be ****ed off too, but then, it is going to add a good amount of spice between these two guys isn't it?
I do confess to not recalling the second incident involving Monteiro.

corkholio · 28 Feb 2003, 08:12 (Ref:520177)

I missed most part of the Bourdais-Fernandez incident so I don't really want to comment on that. But I can tell you that fatal accidents don't need more than one moment to occur.

Jay · 28 Feb 2003, 15:39 (Ref:520522)

It was bad manners more than anything else... Bourdias with a flat tire would not allow Fernandez to pass him for about half a lap, costing Adrian around 15 seconds.

Jordi · 28 Feb 2003, 18:39 (Ref:520685)

Quote:

Originally posted by corkholio
But I can tell you that fatal accidents don't need more than one moment to occur.

It is obvious, not only in racing but in life. But do we stay all day at home so we do not risk anything?

mp356a · 28 Feb 2003, 20:35 (Ref:520791)

Hello,
I watched the race and do not think that Haberfield blocked Bruno badly. He moved once each time which is within the rules. He left room on the inside and the outside. It was for position.
He had a few other questionable moves that I think Chris K. should speak to him about but I think this kid is doing what he is being paid to do and that's race for position. I can not see how you can compare this to Stefan's move on Jeff K. The Mrs. & I were huge Jeff Krosnoff fans and that was one the worst moments I can remember while watching a race. Worse than Imola '94, for us.
Regarding Bruno, he thinks/thought the championship is/would be his because he moved to last year's winning team and he came in second last year. In my opinion, he is a cry baby and will not hold up to the pressure of fairly equal cars and a batch of highly talented drivers. This should be one of CART's finest seasons.
Mike

corkholio · 28 Feb 2003, 22:22 (Ref:520889)

Quote:

Originally posted by Jordi
It is obvious, not only in racing but in life. But do we stay all day at home so we do not risk anything?

Of course not. But you would be an idiot to purposely take risks that greatly incrases those chance.

Jordi · 28 Feb 2003, 22:22 (Ref:520890)

Welcome to the forum Mike! I see you have a strong opinion against Bruno...

Jordi · 28 Feb 2003, 22:24 (Ref:520895)

Quote:

Originally posted by corkholio
Of course not. But you would be an idiot to purposely take risks that greatly incrases those chance.

Here's the quid of the question! You think Haberfeld is an idiot for doing those moves and I think he races within the rules, not being an idiot.

Let's agree that we disagree...

mp356a · 28 Feb 2003, 22:40 (Ref:520903)

Thanks for the welcome Jordi. I do not have a strong opinion of him. I just don't like whiners. He is very fast, no doubt, but I would never have labeled him a "favorite" for 2003 as others have.
As most of the folks here, racing is a passion for me and part of that is the personalities.
Many folks are quick but I also like to see some honest to goodness goodguys like Krosnoff, Vasser, Zanardi, Panis, Brundle, Bourdais, Wallace (Andy), Jeremy Dale (remember him in Sportscars?), Pruett, deFeran (sp?) - (of the, gasp, IRL), even Christiano was a better sport, guys like that. If you don't win, don't cry about it. The guy seldom gives any credit to drivers who beat him. It's more like "I would have won but....".
Even Schumacher gives credit to other drivers and he's I guy about whom I do have a strong opinion!
He's not the only guy like that so I am not singling him out or at least I don't mean to. He is just the most vocal at the moment.
Mike

djb · 1 Mar 2003, 00:08 (Ref:520988)

well Mike, we all look forward to talking about this season as it unfolds, welcome.

enemy-ace · 3 Mar 2003, 20:23 (Ref:523765)

I know this subject has been thoroughly beaten about and that the "one-move" rule is legal; however i thought that maybe a little lesson about one of the all-time greats would maybe put a better perspective on our sport.

Keke Rosberg Quote:

"To Gilles, racing truly was a sport, which
is why he would never chop you. Something
like that he'd look on with contempt. You
didn't have to be a good driver to do that,
let alone a great one. Anyone could do that.
Gilles was the hardest ******* I ever raced
against, but completely fair. If you'd
beaten him to a corner, he accepted it and
gave you room. Then he'd be right back at
you at the next one! Sure, he took
unbelievable risks - but only with himself -
and that's why I get ****ed off now when
people compare Senna with him. Gilles was
a giant of a driver, yes, but he was also a
great man."

djb · 4 Mar 2003, 04:29 (Ref:524121)

hear hear

Liz · 4 Mar 2003, 12:30 (Ref:524412)

Yes, Prof. Watkins says the same -- he says that on one occasion Gilles passed him by about an inch when he was going to the aid of someone in a crashed car, but Gilles could judge such things so finely that Watkins was not worried. Mario has also said the same -- he said that he never worried about whether Gilles could be trusted as he always could.

Haberfeld seems to be able to handle his car quite well for a rookie, but I hope the Powers that Be will make sure he doesn't get above himself and think he's better than he is.

And I agree about Bruno -- he's a very fast guy and very good but he needs to take some lessons at the Tony Cicale School of Chilling Out.

djb · 5 Mar 2003, 02:35 (Ref:525182)

Liz, I recall the Watkins story, it was how that once the safety car he was in got caught up by some of the leaders of a race before it got around the first lap (usually there was time for it to get back to the pits before the leaders came around). I remember him saying how close Gilles went by, not for any reason except for fun and showing just how close he could go by.