Bezzy wins

[Ray Singcar]

This is the way It happened. Bright , Besnard Skaife & Tratt were leading as they had not pitted. When the safety car came out they pitted. The safety car picked up new leader Murf and slowed the field. This allowed the 4 to exit the pits IN FRONT of the safety car (and Besnard had jumped Bright in the pits). They then sped around to the rear of the field & were in fact then 3/4 lap in front of Murpy. The Safety car then waved Murph & the field around & they then fell into line behind Bezzy & Co . The race started and at the next yellow the safety car then waved Bezzy & Co around to go to the rear of the field, putting them 3/4 lap in front again. Then before the end of the race they had 1 lap removed from their count which adjusted them back towards the rear on live timing. However they crossed the finish line to complete 42 laps, 3/4 of a lap before Murphy.

The error was made by the Safety car not picking up Bright in the first instance. This is not Bright Bezzy or Skaifes fault & they croosed the line first. Plain & simple.

[GTRMagic]

All they have to do is find someone in Race Control and/or Race Timing to blame it on and she'll be sweet

From RaceNews' HRT Report

Round Summary:
A bizarre end to Race 3 saw claims of the cars of Skaife, Besnard and Bright performing an extra lap after a mix up with safety cars had relegated the then top three to the rear of the pack. An explanation from CAMS has been requested.

[Techo]

It's a easy thing to have happen
But can never really be re-dressed, as the damage was done -
It's a multi-million dollor business !
Where else would you see a tow trunk bogged to the axles- how embrassment
Oh well- everyone still gets paid...

[GTRMagic]

It might be easy to have happen, but the timing team would have seen who was in pitlane and how they got there, and out again... if not the chief timing bod, one of the many observers they keep in the timing room, which normally has a full view of that part of the circuit...

I know some drivers made mention on the coverage that they were falling asleep (thanks Cam... ) while behind the safety car, but surely it would make more sense to get their act together and make the right decision as opposed to making a decision in the interests of expediency?

[William Dale Jr]

I can't wait for next week's edition of "Gory's Corner"

[Techo]

ROBBED !!!
We should of won - hell we turned up did'nt we !
It's about time we were winning don't you think Tony !!!1

[GTRMagic]

But how do you reconstruct something like that? Its a total mess, and only theoretical times and averages can be used to make a call.

Quickest answer would be to declare it a non race, but I presume there is some rule somewhere that says the timekeeper of the meeting has already approved an apparently incorrect result sheet, and there isnt a mechanism to correct it anyway....

Process & protocol... should be established for any possible scenario... not make it up as we go along and hope nobody notices...

[Bedford]

Originally posted by Techo
It's a multi-million dollor business !
Where else would you see a tow trunk bogged to the axles- how embrassment

OT : For god's sake, learn some grammar!

[Bedford]

THEORETICALLY -
At the end of the race Skaife said he completed an extra lap (43, instead of 42) because he was in the lead group, and then waved behind the rest of the group.
Theoretically, if Murphy were the true leader, and waved past the safety car to line up behind the lead group, shouldn't he have completed one lap extra, after getting a free ride to the back of the back runners who were at the front?
Or did it even itself out when the lead group was waved back around to the back of the pack?

[figjam]

Originally posted by Bedford
OT : For god's sake, learn some grammar!

I think that was a quote from Effie, or what ever she was called

[retro]

Mr Gore is confident of a win

[1200Datto27]

As I have said on another disscussion, it is possible that the three drivers that hadn't pitted had enough of a gap on the rest of the field (who had pitted) to complete their pitstops, and return to the track before the rest came around, there for they where in the right.

But I guess the powers that be didn't want to upset Murph again.

[TerryK]

Nascar car handle stops under yellow, CAMS-AVESO can't why ?

In Nascar once the pace car comes out no one can pit (pits closed )for the 1st lap under yellow.
on the next lap cars on the lead lap can pit, then next lap after that lapped cars can pit.

The only way to the front is to stay out..this system works well pity these boffheads can't even control a bloody race.

Do away with the CPS & close the pits during the yellow laps is one way to keep it simple.

This is not the 1st time the pace car has picked up the wrong car as the leader.
professionals I don't think so..!!!!!!!!!

[Nicholosophy]

Originally posted by TerryK
Do away with the CPS & close the pits during the yellow laps is one way to keep it simple.

What a sensible idea.

Which means we'll never see it happen.

[William Dale Jr]

Originally posted by TerryK
Nascar car handle stops under yellow, CAMS-AVESO can't why ?

In Nascar once the pace car comes out no one can pit (pits closed )for the 1st lap under yellow.
on the next lap cars on the lead lap can pit, then next lap after that lapped cars can pit.

NASCAR has actually made quite a few errors this year in timing and scoring when the yellow flags have come out. There was a problem at one of the Dover races (the one Mark Martin won) and maybe the two Pocono races as well, so NASCAR isn't totally immune to this sort of thing.

[Onlooker]

perhaps it is time to fit little electronic senders to the cars, and each time they pass the start finish line it records the car has passed

hey you could even put them in pitlane to see what cars have pitted, infact you could put some around the track for sector times too.

If AVESCO were smart they could even charge to watch this info and feed it to the teams.

I think it is time unfortunatly to tell the Womens Auxilery that are handling the timing with egg timers that they are nolonger needed



F@&KING DISGRACEFUL

[Chris - Melb]

I have broken my vow never to use this forum again, but I can’t believe what happened today. I believe Besnard was in the lead of the race after the “Paul Weel” pace car.

I replayed the telecast and noticed that Bright, Besnard, Skaife and Tratt passed the scene of the Weel accident just after the yellow flag came out. They had about a 20 second lead over the rest of the field. I presume the four completed the rest of the lap at full speed because they knew they could make a pit stop and potential pass each other (as Besnard eventually did to Bright).

I don’t know how quickly the safety car came out but at BEST the rest of the field would have had to complete the rest of the one third of a lap (20 secs) that they where behind those four, plus then do another lap before the said four reappeared from their pit stops.

So the rest of the field lost anywhere between 20 to 50 seconds completing that lap at reduced speed, even if the safety car hadn’t come out at that stage.

So if you add the 20 sec lead the fab four already had PLUS the 20 to 50 seconds that the rest of the field lost on the following lap under the full course yellow, they had enough time to make their pit stops and still come out in front of the field, never ever losing the lead!

Mind you, I think having compulsory pit stops stinks and that Besnard didn’t deserve to win.

Chris.

[eduardo1]

The problem with closing the pit lane under yellows in the 100km races is that the risk for using an alternate strategy aren't worth it.

This used to be the rule, however what happened is that EVERYBODY came straight into pit lane on the lap the window opened. Because if you hadn't pitted by the time the first Safety Car appeared, you were history. This happened numerous times, so the rule was changed in order to promote a more strategic approach.

Which, if the timekeepers don't stuff up, was what happened at Symmons and could potentially we would have had a new race winner this year in Bezzy.

While ever we have artificial pit stops, you can't close the pits during yellows. NASCAR can because their races are long enough that you need several stops. Same as at Bathurst or Sandown or even some of the 300km races. Anything under 200-220km races and you can run it on a single tank.

[mjt57]

Originally posted by GTRMagic
Process & protocol... should be established for any possible scenario... not make it up as we go along and hope nobody notices...

It seems to me, as a casual race goer and TV watcher, that the way that this series is run is on an ad hoc basis. Witness constant rule changes throughout the season for one. This makes for an unfair and inequitable competition by shifting the goal posts.

I hope that these people don't regard themselves as "professionals".

[mjt57]

Originally posted by TerryK
Do away with the CPS & close the pits during the yellow laps is one way to keep it simple.

Terry, did you also think that the idea of pitting for tyres, 3 laps in (about 6 km of tracktime), was somewhat ludicrous?

The television spectacle of more than half the race field pitting at once looked silly.

They should take it one step further. Make the drivers get out and go to the toilet, then line up to pay for the fuel at a cash register/checkout (using the Shell fuel card, of course).

As I've said over and over, and over, and over, CPS make for staged and contrived racing. It gives unfair advantages to what could otherwise be underperforming drivers. As an example, a driver pitting during a pace car (and you can't tell me that there was any "safety" aspect to the pace car's role in Race 3) and gaining a track advantage because other drivers pitted during race conditions.

[Luke Plaizier]

And if we take the fielders out of a cricket game, we can keep it pure and make it a game of bowler versus batter. This whole notion of adding fielders to a game makes it contrived, and stops a good batter from scoring boundaries.

Wouldn't it be much better to watch a one-to-one sport like that than the current team sport?


Lukeyson

[Hazza]

My 2cs is basicly that AVESCO has 2 choices, back to the 3X100 race, or stick with a 1x300 race for each round, and reduce the fuel capacity so they have to stop. Pretty simple. But then you factor in the snooze fest of doing 300kms around Oran Park/Paperclip/Symmonds plains then you have a problem.

Did anyone realy *HATE* the 3 race format? or the early 90s 1 race format? How about a BTCC style, with second race inverted top 10?

[Sandgroper]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Onlooker
[B]perhaps it is time to fit little electronic senders to the cars, and each time they pass the start finish line it records the car has passed

hey you could even put them in pitlane to see what cars have pitted, infact you could put some around the track for sector times too.

Yeah Onlooker is isnt really rocket science is it. MY boy races Remote control cars that each carry electron transponders that time each race and all sectors of the track, they have the odd issue but very rarely.
wonders hrug:

[Gaz170]

I thought the cars DID have transponders. They should in this day & age.

[Trev Campbell]

Originally posted by Hazza
My 2cs is basicly that AVESCO has 2 choices, back to the 3X100 race, or stick with a 1x300 race for each round, and reduce the fuel capacity so they have to stop. Pretty simple. But then you factor in the snooze fest of doing 300kms around Oran Park/Paperclip/Symmonds plains then you have a problem.

Did anyone realy *HATE* the 3 race format? or the early 90s 1 race format? How about a BTCC style, with second race inverted top 10?

Yes because when it was in, If you qualified on the front row and got a good start you were virtually garanteed the win. This was also at a time of HRT Dominance which wouldn't have helped things.