California Dreamin'

macdaddy · 13 Sep 2005, 18:33 (Ref:1406913)

I can't help but think to myself,

How nice it would be if ChampCar could work something out with Fontana for next year. Maybe in conjunction with the trucks or something. I miss the superspeedways, and 2006 might be the last chance if the 2007 chassis isn't being designed for them.

Teach some of the young kids what five hundred miles is all about.

[/Califonia Dream]

Kicking-back · 13 Sep 2005, 18:47 (Ref:1406922)

I think there's absolutely no chance.

2007 is likely to be oval-free, so I don't think ChampCar would see any point in adding one next year.

macdaddy · 13 Sep 2005, 19:01 (Ref:1406943)

Yeah... I'm awake now.

It's just sad, these chassis were built to withstand those tracks. A "swan song" would be wonderful. They should do it just out of the kindness of their heart, especially for me.

Kicking-back · 13 Sep 2005, 19:15 (Ref:1406963)

The Macdaddy 500 they could call it.

codename_47 · 14 Sep 2005, 00:36 (Ref:1407187)

Autoweek report on the new champcar

"Sources indicate the car will be suitable for both road-course and oval work"

Perhaps the report of the death of ovals is premature!

Keep on dreaming Macdaddy.....Keep on Dreaming!

enemy-ace · 14 Sep 2005, 01:54 (Ref:1407215)

Champ Car at Fontana would be great. I certainly echo Macdaddy's feelings.
Excuse my ignorance, but why did the IRL drop it from it's schedule?

stmookeyj033 · 14 Sep 2005, 02:34 (Ref:1407231)

Quote:

Originally Posted by enemy-ace

Champ Car at Fontana would be great. I certainly echo Macdaddy's feelings.
Excuse my ignorance, but why did the IRL drop it from it's schedule?

I believe it was falling attendances, but mainly scheduling issues.

marcus · 14 Sep 2005, 05:15 (Ref:1407253)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

The Macdaddy 500 they could call it.

Nahhhhhhhh

It should be the "Macdaddy 501"

Because its Macdaddy I think they should go that extra Mile

D.R.T. · 14 Sep 2005, 07:10 (Ref:1407315)

Quote:

Originally Posted by codename_47

Autoweek report on the new champcar

"Sources indicate the car will be suitable for both road-course and oval work"

That is great news as the loss of oval racing to the series would be quite sad, even though they only have 1-2 races now.

rustyfan · 14 Sep 2005, 07:55 (Ref:1407338)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

2007 is likely to be oval-free, so I don't think ChampCar would see any point in adding one next year.

No doubt replacing them with more street circuits. By 2010 I predict that there won't be any natural terrain road courses left either, making it an all-street/airport circuit championship.

Man, that will be so much fun. Can't wait. Really.

Kicking-back · 14 Sep 2005, 08:19 (Ref:1407364)

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.R.T.

That is great news as the loss of oval racing to the series would be quite sad, even though they only have 1-2 races now.

Just because the car could be used on ovals doesn't mean it will be.

Jordi · 14 Sep 2005, 08:42 (Ref:1407398)

I know that was CART and this is different and all that crap, but truth of the matter is that old CART had a great mix of road courses, short ovals, speedways, street courses and an airport, and nowadays it's 75% street vs. 25% anything else.

I will never tire of saying it, CART had a true test of drivers and teams at the most diverse venues. No other series had something like it. The champion had to be good everywhere, while if we continue to go down the street-race way, soon the champion will just have to score poles and keep ahead in difficult-to-pass tracks.

I like street circuits. I just don't think they should be the majority and I think races like Michigan or Fontana used to really put the people to the edge of their seats. Hey, even the cars just looked more beautiful, with those small wings!

rustyfan · 14 Sep 2005, 08:53 (Ref:1407404)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

I know that was CART and this is different and all that crap, but truth of the matter is that old CART had a great mix of road courses, short ovals, speedways, street courses and an airport, and nowadays it's 75% street vs. 25% anything else.

I will never tire of saying it, CART had a true test of drivers and teams at the most diverse venues. No other series had something like it. The champion had to be good everywhere, while if we continue to go down the street-race way, soon the champion will just have to score poles and keep ahead in difficult-to-pass tracks.

I like street circuits. I just don't think they should be the majority and I think races like Michigan or Fontana used to really put the people to the edge of their seats. Hey, even the cars just looked more beautiful, with those small wings!

Superb post.

BootsOntheSide · 14 Sep 2005, 11:18 (Ref:1407574)

Excellent post Jordi, and I'd agree that a more diverse championship is a bigger challenge for everyone. Street circuits are a challenge in their own right, as the iportance of qualifying is emphasised and the close proximity of the walls requires very precise driving, and the ability to think on your feet and adjust to full-course yellows, but a series dominated by them relaly loses a lot in terms of thrills and challenge. I don't think they're the best way of getting the series a solid fanbase either - they may get great attendances in their own right, but how amny of those who attend a big event in their home city will actually go away from it in love with motor racing and keen to follow the series week-in week-out?

Amar7605 · 14 Sep 2005, 15:03 (Ref:1407767)

What I wish that Champ Car could do was that if the trend is to have more street courses, then have at least 3 or 4 more superspeedways. This is because the street courses cannot showcase the pure speed that speedways can.

Of course, people have to actually go to the speedways, so there has to be some serious marketing involved.

codename_47 · 14 Sep 2005, 19:01 (Ref:1407941)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

I know that was CART and this is different and all that crap, but truth of the matter is that old CART had a great mix of road courses, short ovals, speedways, street courses and an airport, and nowadays it's 75% street vs. 25% anything else.

I will never tire of saying it, CART had a true test of drivers and teams at the most diverse venues. No other series had something like it. The champion had to be good everywhere, while if we continue to go down the street-race way, soon the champion will just have to score poles and keep ahead in difficult-to-pass tracks.

I like street circuits. I just don't think they should be the majority and I think races like Michigan or Fontana used to really put the people to the edge of their seats. Hey, even the cars just looked more beautiful, with those small wings!

Yes, and very successful it was for the series, wasn't it......

Oh wait, no CART died. Champcar must race where it's wanted, not where NASCAR is already king or where promoters love to play games and start bidding wars between the two open wheel series to try and increase their share of the profits....

These places are becoming few and far between.

If you don't enjoy it.....there's the door. But it's that or Champcar being nailed into it's own wooden box, so which would you all really prefer?

codename_47 · 14 Sep 2005, 19:22 (Ref:1407951)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Just because the car could be used on ovals doesn't mean it will be.

Why on EARTH would they build in all the extra safety protection, carbon brakes and many other sundry oval only settings into the car if they don't intend to use it?? It'd just be a waste of money and weight otherwise....

To me, the fact they're building the car as being oval-ready means that it will be raced on ovals......but that's just me.

Amar7605 · 14 Sep 2005, 19:43 (Ref:1407963)

I agree with K-B - CC may not intend to race on ovals. But the chassis specs has to last for at least a few years, so if during that period CC gets some opportunities to race on ovals, then they already have cars that are ready. That way the teams do not need to buy oval-specialized chassis. This saves costs.

norman-normal · 14 Sep 2005, 20:49 (Ref:1408004)

Very good post codename. I agree 100%; KK is very good at dealing with greedy people who like to play games.
Road america, Fontana, etal, may want to get serious in the future and until the there are still 52 weekends in the year.

macdaddy · 14 Sep 2005, 20:53 (Ref:1408006)

In the mid-90's, didn't the teams have several different chassis? Each one suited to a particular type of course, with different wheelbases ect?

Jordi · 14 Sep 2005, 21:35 (Ref:1408036)

Quote:

Originally Posted by codename_47

Yes, and very successful it was for the series, wasn't it......

Oh wait, no CART died. Champcar must race where it's wanted, not where NASCAR is already king or where promoters love to play games and start bidding wars between the two open wheel series to try and increase their share of the profits....

These places are becoming few and far between.

If you don't enjoy it.....there's the door. But it's that or Champcar being nailed into it's own wooden box, so which would you all really prefer?

If the mix of tracks had been the main culprit for CART's death then I'd agree with you. But it's not, so I don't.

codename_47 · 14 Sep 2005, 23:24 (Ref:1408123)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordi

If the mix of tracks had been the main culprit for CART's death then I'd agree with you. But it's not, so I don't.

Ok, then think about who owns most of the ovals in America these days....and how exactly Champcar would managed to get them to let them race at their tracks....

rustyfan · 15 Sep 2005, 06:52 (Ref:1408235)

Quote:

Originally Posted by codename_47

Yes, and very successful it was for the series, wasn't it......

Oh wait, no CART died.

CART going public was, IMHO, the primary reason it died. Having a diverse schedule wasn't a problem in the 80's and early- to mid-90's (when Champ Car still was very popular), you know

Jordi · 15 Sep 2005, 17:22 (Ref:1408674)

Quote:

Originally Posted by codename_47

Ok, then think about who owns most of the ovals in America these days....and how exactly Champcar would managed to get them to let them race at their tracks....

But if we have to go to the start of the problem, the reason as to why certain people owning certain tracks is a problem, you must go back to the split with Indy, at least.

My point is that having a diverse schedule isn't what killed CART. If that had been the problem I wonder why Indy Car racing was so successful in the late 80s and early 90s, when the schedule was as diverse as in the latter CART days. The only difference in CART's latter days is that there were more trips overseas. But having a diverse schedule doesn't necessarily mean trips outside USA, Canada and Mexico.

Snrub · 15 Sep 2005, 18:21 (Ref:1408709)

Quote:

Originally Posted by macdaddy

In the mid-90's, didn't the teams have several different chassis? Each one suited to a particular type of course, with different wheelbases ect?

I thought that it was primarly changes in front and rear wings.

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